Louis: Checked some assignment sheets, and from June 1945 until sometime in 1946 the 7014, 7019 and 7020 were leased to the FW&D, not the C&S. I have or have seen several photos of them operating on the C&S leg of trains 7-8, however, and just because they were leased to the "Denver" doesn't mean they didn't regularly run over the C&S. The earliest 1946 assignment sheet I have is for September, and they were back on the Alliance Division by then. This 1945-46 usage by the C&S-FW&D was not the first, however, and at the bottom of page 48 in Corbin's Burlington in Transition is a Dick Kindig photo of 7019, a coal-burner, pulling No. 8 north at Pikeview, just north of Colorado Springs, on June 17, 1939. That's probably the lease to the C&S that I was recalling. Hol
To: CBQ@yahoogroups.com From: CBQ@yahoogroups.com Date: Wed, 8 Oct 2014 17:07:10 -0400 Subject: Re: [CBQ] Where Was This Image Taken?
October 8, 2014
Hol - Thanks! That was a pretty long run at the time. Can you narrow it
down to what year(s) 7020 was assigned? Obviously, 1946 and/or later. Best
Regards - Louis
Louis Zadnichek II
Fairhope, AL
In a message dated 10/8/2014 3:50:18 P.M. Central Daylight Time,
CBQ@yahoogroups.com writes:
Jim's right, that is indeed the C&S Seventh Street engine
terminal in Denver, with the Ross & White steel coaling station erected in
1946 behind the tender. The 7020 was being used between Denver and
Texline on trains 7-8 at that time. Hol
To: CBQ@yahoogroups.com From: CBQ@yahoogroups.com Date: Wed, 8 Oct 2014
10:17:50 -0600 Subject: RE: [CBQ] Where Was This Image Taken?
That coal tower and
water tank sure look like Denver’s Rice Yard engine service area. I’d be
surprised if any other Lines West yard looked exactly like that, but I could
be wrong.
Very nice
photo...
Jim
Ferenc
Boulder,
CO
From:
CBQ@yahoogroups.com [mailto:CBQ@yahoogroups.com]
Sent: Wednesday, October 08, 2014 8:37
AM
To:
cbq@yahoogroups.com
Subject:
[CBQ] Where Was This Image Taken?
Gene, Hol and All -
As it turns out, I can now answer part of my question on how 7020 appeared
near the end of its service life on Lines West. I did have an image of the
4-8-2 after it had been modernized with a disc main driver and converted to
burn oil. Note the heavily modified tender with its oversize oil bunker.
The image is undated and identified as being taken at Lincoln, but from the
size and shape of the steel coal chute, that is incorrect. Can any Lines
West expert tell me where this image was taken from the coal chute
and, I think, fuel oil storage tank alongside? Could it be Alliance,
NE? A classy looking B-1-A. Best Regards - Louis
From:
LZadnichek@aol.com
To: CBQ@yahoogroups.com
Sent: 10/6/2014 11:13:48
A.M. Central Daylight Time
Subj: Re: [CBQ] Where Was This Image
Taken?
Gene - Thanks for
checking your locomotive assignment sheets. Ottumwa, IA,
interesting. Some of the younger members of the Group may not
realize that in the steam era prior to the Class S-4 and Class O-5 passenger
locomotives that earlier steam power such as the Class B-1-A's
were often changed at each division point for a "fresh" engine. Thus,
in the mid-1920s when the 4-8-2's were the epitome of passenger power,
they would, for instance, run from CUS to Galesburg, change engines,
Galesburg to Ottumwa, change engines, Ottumwa to Creston, change engines,
Creston to Omaha/Lincoln, change engines and so on. So, in that era, 7020
would've bounced between Galesburg and Creston with its home terminal as
Ottumwa. Later, the "modern" S-4 and O-5 engines were often run through from
CUS to Omaha/Lincoln that eliminated the need for time consuming engine
changes and need for multiple locomotives resulting in significant savings.
Since Galesburg was not in a valley to where you could see hills in the
background and the Ottumwa engine terminal wasn't large enough to
support such a large ash gantry crane, nor was Omaha, and we've already
eliminated Lincoln, I guess Dayton's Bluff remains the most likely location
by process of elimination. A thought crossed my mind that maybe 7020
is pictured in Savanna due to the background hills, but, again, that engine
terminal wasn't large enough to support such a crane. Plus, we can
cross out both the Clyde and Western Avenue engine terminals in Chicago due
to the background hills. I did check the June 1935 and February
1952 locomotive assignment sheets in the Corbin book to see what
happened to 7020. The 1935 sheet shows her assigned to the Chicago Division
that means 7020 could've ventured to Dayton's Bluff engine terminal in
St. Paul, MN. I personally think the image in question was taken in the late
1930s or into the 1940s. The February 1952 sheet shows that 7020
had been reassigned to the Alliance Division in western Nebraska.
7020 was among the last four Class B-1-A's retired, all in May 1955. I
do not know if 7020 was modernized with a disc main driver as
several class engines were, but the 1952 sheet identifies her as having
been converted to burn oil. The Corbin book also reports 7020 was
equipped with roller bearings on the main driver. I have two other
images, both unidentified as to date and location, of 7020 as a coal burner,
but none of her as an oil burner on Lines West. If any Group
member has an image they'd like to share of 7020 on Lines West as an
oil burner, I'd sure enjoy seeing it. Best Regards -
Louis
In a message dated
10/5/2014 5:28:18 P.M. Central Daylight Time, CBQ@yahoogroups.com
writes:
Louis,
I have copies of a bunch of
locomotive assignment sheets and 7020 was assigned as
below:
|
ENGINE |
DATE |
2/1/1923 |
1/1/1925 |
12/1/1925 |
12/1/1928 |
8/1/1931 |
11/1/1932 |
6/1/1935 |
4/1/1937 |
4/1/1939 |
2/1/1941 |
9/1/1942 |
1/1/1948 |
1/1/1950 |
6/1/1950 |
10/1/1950 |
|
4/1/1952 |
12/1/1953 |
10/1/1954 |
4/1/1955 |
|
B-1A |
7020 |
|
|
OTTUMWA |
|
|
AURORA |
CHICAGO |
CHICAGO |
CHICAGO |
BEARDSTOWN |
CHICAGO |
ALLIANCE |
CASPER |
CASPER |
ALLIANCE |
|
ALLIANCE |
ALLIANCE |
ALLIANCE |
CONDEMNED |
Maybe this will help find
the location.
Gene
From:
CBQ@yahoogroups.com [mailto:CBQ@yahoogroups.com]
Sent: Sunday, October 5, 2014 5:04
PM
To:
CBQ@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [CBQ] Where Was This
Image Taken?
Hol -
OK, none of the above..... That's the FUN in trying to identify old
photographs. At least we're pretty sure where the image wasn't
taken! I agree, could be Dayton's Bluff engine terminal in St. Paul, MN.
Perhaps, some one else in the Group will have an educated guess, or a
list of where such gantry style ash handling conveyors were located.
Had to be at a major engine terminal where removing the huge volume of
ashes and cinders would require mechanical assistance. While there
are some number of Q coal dock/tower/chute images in existance, I very
seldom see any of ash handling machinery. I guess it's a subject
now pretty much lost to time. Enjoy your Sunday afternoon -
Louis
You're right; that does appear to
be a hill line, visible both in front of and behind 7020. And in
Denver the South Platte River would be in that area, so it's not Denver
or Lincoln -- or Galesburg either. I don't know if the Dayton's
Bluff engine facilities has one of these conveyors, but the B-!-A's were
used a lot on the Twin Cities line, too, and a hill would be visible
there.
Hol
To:
CBQ@yahoogroups.com
From: CBQ@yahoogroups.com
Date: Sun,
5 Oct 2014 17:38:47 -0400
Subject: Re: [CBQ] Where Was This Image
Taken?
Hol -
Many thanks! Looking at the faint background, does that look like
a hill line to you? The Lincoln engine terminal as I recall was built on
flat terrain. Would a hill line be visible from the Denver engine
terminal? What do you think. All this will help in identifying the other
"gantry" images. Best Regards - Louis
Louis:
Denver,
Galesburg and Creston, that I know of, also used this style of cinder
gantry. Since it's the 7020, my bet is Denver or Lincoln; not
enough background to be
sure.
Hol
To:
cbq@yahoogroups.com
From: CBQ@yahoogroups.com
Date:
Sun, 5 Oct 2014 17:20:39 -0400
Subject: [CBQ] Where Was This Image
Taken?
Hol
and Group - Where was this undated image taken of Class B-1-A
7020?
I
"think" it's Lincoln from the traveling gantry crane used to clean the
ash pits looming over the 4-8-2. Was Lincoln the only Q engine
terminal set-up with such a gantry? I have a number of
unidentified engine terminal images all showing the above gantry crane
(or one like it if more than one terminal was so equipped). Would
appreciate your comments and thoughts on this subject. Best
Regards - Louis
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Posted by: Hol Wagner <holpennywagner@msn.com>
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