Greetings Pete,
You are brilliant. Well done.
And many thanks.
Mark
----- Original Message ----
From: "Jpslhedgpeth@aol.com" <Jpslhedgpeth@aol.com>
To: CBQ@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Friday, July 4, 2008 4:56:11 AM
Subject: Re: [CBQ] C&S Crewing rights over the Joint Line.
Mark...Believe it or not I found what you wanted to know.
August 24, 1954
Denver-- Colo Spgs...No. 1? Texas Zephyr...... My 1953 Guide shows...Denver
12:01 pm?? CS 1:40 pm
Colo Spgs---Denver? ? No. 8??????????? ????????? ????????? ????????? ?????????
????????? ?????? CS??????? 6:10pm????Denver 8:05
I may be "digging" in my slides in the next month or so and If so I'll try to
find that slide of an ATSF center cab
at CS with dual?? C&S-ASF lettering.? Would have been taken that same day.
Also seems like the Southbound TZ ran via the DRGW DEpot at CS and the
Northbound No. 8 via the ATSF depot at CS.
Pete
-----Original Message-----
From: Jpslhedgpeth@ aol.com
To: CBQ@yahoogroups. com
Sent: Wed, 2 Jul 2008 9:06 am
Subject: Re: [CBQ] C&S Crewing rights over the Joint Line.
Mark
I can get it found, but it may take awhile...I know the year was 1954...think I
put 55 on my original post.? The month would have been August.
We came back from C. Spgs in the late afternoon... Also I'm sure I've got a
slide of a ATSF center cab switcher at CS...It may have the " lettering".. .I'm
not sure
Give me a few days and remind me again if you don't hear....My railfan buddy
Jim Christen kept a "log" of ;our trips with train numbers etc.? I have a copy
of it, if I can find it...
Pete
-----Original Message-----
From: Mark Sellars <sellarsmark_ aus@yahoo. com>
To: CBQ@yahoogroups. com
Sent: Wed, 2 Jul 2008 6:26 am
Subject: Re: [CBQ] C&S Crewing rights over the Joint Line.
Greetings Pete,
How is your memory? Coudl you recall the train number, or the railroad and or
the time of day and direction you took for your?trip over the Joint Line?
This will help me fix a bench mark for when trains carried mixed crews.
many thanks, Mark
----- Original Message ----
From: "Jpslhedgpeth@ aol.com" <Jpslhedgpeth@ aol.com>
To: CBQ@yahoogroups. com
Sent: Wednesday, June 25, 2008 9:53:13 AM
Subject: Re: [CBQ] C&S Crewing rights over the Joint Line.
>From strictly memory of my one and only trip over the joint line in August
>1955, seems I remember that on the passenger trains you could have a "mixed"
>train crew....Maybe a Q (C&S) Conductor and a ATSF Brakeman or two.
Pete
-----Original Message-----
From: Bob Webber <rgz17@comcast. net>
To: CBQ@yahoogroups. com
Sent: Tue, 24 Jun 2008 7:05 pm
Subject: Re: [CBQ] C&S Crewing rights over the Joint Line.
The D&RGW / D&RG also ran the MP, CRI&P and AT&SF trains. Before the
Santa Fe built their line north from Colorado Springs, the D&RG
handled their trains - the locomotives used (and for freight, the
cabooses), were the first standard gauged equipment on the
railroad. Of course, that also meant that the D&RG line was 3 rails.
At 06:28 PM 6/24/2008, you wrote:
>Greetings Russ,
>
>I have copies of the Joint Operating Agreements of 1900, 1915 and
>1940. Plus the maps.
>
>Certainly the D&RG(W) always (beware of Murphy's Law) ran their own trains.
>
>And I believe that the C&S and the AT&SF did too, for a while, then
>the AT&SF crews took over (I am not looking at the post merger period here).
>(I am not sure about what happened when the CRI&P and Colorado
>Midland used their landlord's tracks.)
>
>You are right; the the C&S handled all Denver area engine servicing,
>yards (including the AT&SF yards whilst they existed), and locals
>north of South Denver for the AT&SF and the C&S.
>
>And that the AT&SF handled similar business in Colorado Springs and Pueblo.
>
>Lloyd Stagner confirmed that the respective railroads crewed their
>own way cars until the 1940s.
>But what happened after that I don't know.
>
>Russ, many thanks for your input.
>
>Regards, Mark
>----- Original Message ----
>From: Russ Strodtz <borneo@19main. com>
>To: CBQ@yahoogroups. com
>Sent: Tuesday, June 24, 2008 10:02:53 PM
>Subject: Re: [CBQ] C&S Crewing rights over the Joint Line.
>
>
>Mark,
>
>Might be confused many time here. AT&SF, C&S, and D&RGW all had
>their own Denver to Pueblo. Except for a small North and small South
>C&S everything was scrapped. Look at the maps.
>
>C&S got all yard areas at the Denver Terminal. AT&SF got the
>Colorado Springs and Pueblo yard. This was all agreed.
>
>As information current as BNSF runs Denver-LaJunta- Amarillo. Only
>crews and all run East. Runs Amarillo-Trinidad- Denver. This crews
>handle everything West. There is a small local that runs Pueblo
>to LaJunta. Locals can also run BNSF to get from West, Amarillo
>via Dalhart-Stratford- back to Amarillo on UP trackage. That keeps
>everything going still West and then East.
>
>Part of change was Eastbound at Las Animas is on strait line to
>Boise City and Amarillo. Las Animas to Dodge City is now turning
>to go to the South and East. Everything is still at Las Animas, it
>just has the turns different directions. There are a few odd runs
>that have to go to Pueblo-West. Did try it to Trinidad but it was
>not been very good. With Trinidad to Raton sold I don't think they
>can run that way.
>
>Russ
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: Mark Sellars
>To: CBQ@yahoogroups. com
>Sent: Tuesday, 24 June, 2008 03:32
>Subject: [CBQ] C&S Crewing rights over the Joint Line.
>
>Greetings All,
>
>Pardon me if I have asked this question before.
>
>The Joint Line ran between South Denver and Pueblo, Colorado.
>In 1899, with subsequent renewals in 1900, 1915 etc, the Colorado &
>Southern and the Atchison, Topeka & Santa Fe signed a Joint
>Operating Agreement which amongst other thing allowed the C&S to use
>AT&SF [and later, after October 1918, D&RG(W)] trackage between
>South Denver and Pueblo.
>
>Initially C&S trains were crewed by C&S engine men (probably) and
>C&S way cars were crewed by C&S men.
>Sometime in the 1950s(??) the C&S men lost their crewing rights to AT&SF men.
>Can anyone shed light on what happened to cause this and why?
>
>As a matter of interest, AT&SF C&S way cars were assigned to trains
>according to their place on the roster. That is way cars form one
>company frequently brought up the rear of the other's trains; for
>good measure occasionally way cars from each company were assigned.
>
>Regards, Mark Sellars
>Adelaide, South Australia.
>
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>Yahoo! Groups Links
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>
>
>
>
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>Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
Bob Webber
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