I am glad I found it and pushed to save it also. You would not believe how many
old train order ledgers hit the trash can and other assorted unneeded
paperwork. I was flabergasted when I heard about the cleanout...... "You know
all this old paperwork is a fire hazard" type of mentality..... At least a few
of the ledgers were saved.....
Tom Johnson
--- In CBQ@yahoogroups.com, Gerald Edgar <vje68@...> wrote:
>
>
> There were commercial RR business schools as well as mail order outfits where
> such devices were used or purchased as well as by the RR's themselves. The
> machine had tapes for various speeds of sending so 'student' could learn by
> listening and copying once he knew the 'alphabet'. I recall Scott Arden,
> large mail order RRiana dealer in Oregon selling off such units from a just
> closed RR school (Chicago?) in the mid-70's. When I learned code via US Air
> Force, the instructor hand sent at slow speeds and then commercial tapes
> played at various Words Per Minutes (WPM) increments from 7 to 10 to 15 and
> finally up to 32 which was the minimum you needed to pass. Once you could
> receive, it was optional to learn to send but few did as was not req'd (this
> was "70-71).
>
> It's great that was saved at the tower. However I question why the club
> would have thrown anything away still left in Newport Tower! I suspect it
> and Grand Crossing are the only intact towers from the respective RR's
> "LaCrosse" Division.
>
>
> Gerald
>
>
>
>
> To: CBQ@yahoogroups.com
> From: t.m.j@...
> Date: Mon, 13 Dec 2010 21:28:02 +0000
> Subject: [CBQ] Re: FW: Morse Code: A Lost Language
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> This has been a very interesting thread and have enjoyed it. It really hit me
> since I had a desire to learn morse when I was a teenager. I never did but I
> might have a chance in the near future. To this end, I wanted to let evrybody
> know about a very unique find that is very relevant to this subject. A
> railroad club that I use to belong to here in Minnesota is responsible for
> maintaining and old Joint Milwaukee Road/CB&Q tower that was in Newport
> Minnesota.
>
> I was up in the tower a while back and found a box that had an interseting
> electronic device in it along with several reels of paper tape. After looking
> and inspecting it very closely, I found out that it was a morse code
> tester/sounder. I sequestered the device away to a safe place since the tower
> was being gone through and all of the "trash" was being thrown out. I
> definitely did not want this unit being tossed out.
>
> Since I dropped my membership, I sorta lost track of what happened to the
> unit, but a couple of months ago, one of our local ham radio groups and
> railfans held a ham radio event in the tower. I visited and talked with one
> of the members who is also a club member and asked if he had seen the unit. I
> had let him know sometime before hand (before I dropped my membership) to
> keep track of it. He said he pulled it out and fiddled with it and it would
> start reading the paper tape but than stop and damage the tape. He only let
> one tape get damaged, but I impressed upon him how important the unit was.
>
> Now, I just need to find a historian that could reburbish the unit and find a
> way to copy the paper tapes to new tape so it can be used. I would believe
> the morse is in true dispatcher format which would be very cool to
> hear...........
>
> Tom Johnson
>
> --- In CBQ@yahoogroups.com, "John D. Mitchell, Jr." <cbqrr47@> wrote:
> >
> > Even after they started to use telephones for train orders, the oldtime
> > operators would say BK (break)Â when the dispatcher got too fast to copy!
> >
> > --- On Fri, 12/10/10, Dale Reeves <drale99@> wrote:
> >
> >
> > From: Dale Reeves <drale99@>
> > Subject: Re: [CBQ] FW: Morse Code: A Lost Language
> > To: CBQ@yahoogroups.com
> > Date: Friday, December 10, 2010, 9:15 PM
> >
> >
> > Â
> >
> >
> >
> > My dad, a Q agent/operator, was teaching me to become a helper in '44-'45.
> > I got so I could send a little. The Navy interrupted my RR carreer. Later
> > I was in Northwood, ND on the GN in the early 60's The mayor was agent
> > there. I was in the depot with him, and I started to send on his key. He
> > was impressed, as he didn't know how to telegraph. Evidently the GN branch
> > up there wasn't using the telegraph then -- probably around 1962 I would
> > guess.
> > The thing that always amazed me was how fast those old telegraphers could
> > send and receive. They abreviated a lot, and they could send over 100 words
> > a minute. They could really make those sounders sing! My dad claimed he
> > could send as fast on the key as he could on the bug.
> > Dale Reeves
> >
> > Dale Reeves
> > Original Message -----
> > From: <Jpslhedgpeth@>
> > To: <CBQ@yahoogroups.com>
> > Sent: Tuesday, November 16, 2010 2:30 PM
> > Subject: Re: [CBQ] FW: Morse Code: A Lost Language
> >
> > Gerald et al
> >
> > I seem to remember that 1972 was the last year for telegraph on the Q..but
> > I
> > can't point to any particular reference...IIRC the Rock Island quit the
> > telegraph in1965.
> >
> > Coincidentally I've been reading through some of my od RR Magazines and
> > have
> > recently read some of Palmer's stuff in the 1941 and 42 issues.
> >
> > When I was braking on the Q 1956-58 the branch lines in Nebraska were all
> > telegraph and the mainlines had both telegraph and telephone communication.
> >
> > All of the old head agent-operators were telegraphers..Most of those guys
> > were 1900-1920 seniority and used mostly the key and sounder.
> >
> > Some new agents-operators were coming on and most could telegraph a bit but
> > didn't like to use the key in preference to the phone.
> >
> > There was a young telegrapher who worked on the Lincoln-Ravenna line as an
> > extra operator...It was said of "Arch".. "The only thing Arch can use the
> > key for is to send....FN. ie...."get on the phone"
> >
> > I've opined in my monthly piece in our local railfans club newsletter that
> > the new fad "texting" is nothing more than the old telegrapher's
> > "shorthand"..Those guys never used unnecesary words of letters..
> >
> > In a story by Don Livingston RR October 1941...."Wt dd u sa wd be ur gess
> > on
> > tt local"...Translation..."What did you say would, be your guess on that
> > local".
> >
> > Every telegrapher had a sine by which he was known..Harry Bedwell's Eddie
> > Sand's was DY... Every station had a two letter telegraph call...these were
> > called in Employee timetables through the 1950's and maybe
> > later..example..at El Reno, OK on the RI....El Reno freight yard's call was
> > FO...the passenger depot was RN...There was an old dispatcher...and many of
> > them did likewise still continued to use the telegraph call on the
> > phone...I
> > can still hear old Charlie Forbes..who really didn't need the
> > telephone...yelling into the phone..."Hello FO" when he wanted El Reno yard.
> >
> > Pete
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Gerald Edgar <vje68@>
> > To: cbq <cbq@yahoogroups.com>
> > Sent: Tue, Nov 16, 2010 11:29 am
> > Subject: [CBQ] FW: Morse Code: A Lost Language
> >
> > We have not discussed use of Morse Code on the Q to my recollection; anyone
> > know where on the system was the last use of same? I'm guessing it was
> > post-BN as I recall a Trains article identifying an ex-GN or SOO line in
> > No.
> > Dakota still using Morse in the "80's. When I hired on C&NW in "78 three
> > stations still used Morse; consecutive stops from Marchalltown east on the
> > 'main'. These were 3 senior Agt/operators who insisted the Signal gang keep
> > their wire operational. When they ret'd, that ended Morse on the
> > Northwestern. 9allefgedly there were some rare opccasiopns
> >
> > I learned a semblance of American Morse as a Scout and intensive knowledge
> > of International Morse while in the Air Force; those of you who are old
> > Ham's learned some as well.
> >
> > Any stories out there relating to Morse on the Q? I have a RPPC showing a Q
> > work train with one car clearly marked 'Telegraph Dept'. Dates from 1920's.
> > I think some old equipment bklts also differentiate between Telegraph Dept
> > and Signal Dept. Also Western Union had their own work trains that traveled
> > any & all RR's well into the 60's (even later?)
> >
> > Gerald
> > ----------------------------------------------------------
> >
> > "A LOST LANGUAGE", by LeRoy Palmer. An Article appearing in the June,
> > 1940 issue of "Railroad Magazine", pages 89-92.
> >
> > As months and years drift by, the number of us old-time telegraphers
> > in rail service who know the train wire language is dwindling, like the
> > "thin blue line" and the "thin gray line" of Civil War veterans.On
> > practically all the main-line dispatching circuits the telephone has
> > displaced the telegraph. Only the oldest ops can remember the days
> > when the average train dispatcher had a "copier", a fast pen operator
> > who wrote all orders in the order book as the dispatcher issued them
> > and checked as each was repeated.
> >
> > In this era of telephone dispatching, the work is, of course, done
> > much more quickly. Orders are now repeated in one-fourth the time that
> > was required for even the "gilt-edge" Morse man, although the time and
> > all station names are spelled out, while train and engine numbers are
> > repeated on the telephone. The veteran brass pounder has to admit it,
> > even though he misses the vanishing language. Formerly I could be busy at
> > my
> > desk, or even reading the newspaper, and still hear the train wire with its
> > "OS" reports of trains passing over the district, and thus I kept posted on
> > everything approaching my station. Now I hear nothing unless I sit with the
> > telephone receiver hung over my head. They took some of the romance and
> > fascination away from railroading when they installed telephones on the
> > train wire.
> >
> > The twelve-hour night shift men were excellent "spotters". That is, they
> > were adept at catching much-needed sleep when opportunity offered and they
> > trained themselves to wake for their call. The old Morse dispatchers knew
> > that Bill or Joe was "in the hay" when they got no answer on the first call
> > and they would slowly repeat "RC RC RC DS" or "ZA ZA ZA DS," or whatever
> > the
> > call was, the repeated chatter bringing the Op to life. This was customary
> > and was well understood.
> >
> > One of the first things the op learned was to arouse from deep slumber for
> > his call.
> >
> > I remember the first job I ever worked, night operator for the Milwaukee
> > Road at Burlington, Wis., in 1901. I'd been on the job only a few nights
> > when. One morning just before daylight, I got mighty sleepy and stretched
> > out on the freight desk, with an "Official Guide" making a soft pillow for
> > my head, and was soon sleeping soundly. I dreamed I was walking along a
> > street, and as I passed a store I heard a telegraph instrument tapping out
> > "BU BU BU BY" which was my office call. I thought, "Gosh! I'd better go in
> > there and answer that. It's my call!" The next thing I knew, I was tumbling
> > off that desk onto my feet as I realized that the Beliot dispatcher was
> > hammering out slowly "BU BU BU BU DS."
> >
> > I dove for the telegraph desk.
> >
> > I have had this same dream, or one very much like it, many times since on
> > similar occasions. Other old-time ops report having had identical
> > experience. Seldom would we get deep enough in the hay to fail to recognize
> > the familiar sounder call. There's not much excuse for lightening slingers
> > to drowse on an eight-hour shift nowadays, but should a man working the
> > late
> > night, or third, trick in the heat of Summer, slip off to dreamland between
> > trains, the telephone bell is, perhaps, not the equal of the old repeated
> > Morse call to arouse him from slumber.
> >
> > Perhaps you have sat in some wayside depot waiting-room and listened to the
> > clatter of the instruments in the telegraph office and wished you could
> > understand what was passing over the wire. But missing now from the chorus
> > of clicking sounders is the loudest one of all, the sounder of the train
> > dispatcher's wire. What you would hear now, if you could read them, would
> > be
> > the message wire and the commercial wire, carrying private telegrams. Gone
> > is the hottest and fastest of them all, the sounder with the mysterious
> > abbreviations and language of its own, which every student aspired to read.
> > When a student could read the train wire his education was complete; he was
> > a full-fledged op.
> >
> > In 1900 I was an apprentice at the CMStP&P depot in Elkhorn, Wis. George
> > Hayes was the daylight operator there. In addition to his regular duties,
> > he
> > had the job of teaching two students, Bill Jones and myself. Both of us
> > were
> > green farm hands. I don't know how dumb I was as a ham, but I do remember
> > that Mr. Hayes was in despair over Bill. We both did learn, however. I
> > became a boomer op, and the last I heard of Bill Jordan he was the chief
> > dispatcher for some Western pike.
> >
> > I was given night work with the night man, a short, fat little Irish fellow
> > named Eddie uinane. Eddie was a prince. He used to send to me faithfully an
> > hour or so every night when he wasn't too busy, but he was a rotten sender.
> > The boys along the line had a hard time reading him. But I got accustomed
> > to
> > the funny twists he put on his Morse, and I had no trouble. Later on, when
> > I
> > was working along the line on the extra board, if some op had to copy Eddie
> > and I was around he'd make me sit in and take Eddie's dots and dashes.
> >
> > Meanwhile, I put in about six months with Eddie, showing up when he did at
> > six p.m. and quitting at one a.m. I was beginning to get discouraged. I
> > could read words off the Western Union commercial wire pretty well, but I
> > couldn't get used to those "cut" words used by the dispatchers, even though
> > I listened faithfully, trying to separate the characters and make sense of
> > them.
> >
> > I'll never forget that winter night when I opened the waiting room door,
> > hustled over to the huge coal stove to thaw out, and heard the big
> > train-wire sounder in the office rattling away. I listened a moment, when
> > --
> > just like that-- I could read the language! Boy, was I tickled! What
> > previously had been a jumble of sounds was now clear to me. When Eddie came
> > in a few minutes later, I had the joyous news for him that I could read the
> > train wire, and he seemed as pleased as I was.
> >
> > After that, I was more anxious than ever to perfect myself. One day George
> > Hayes said to me: "Kid, I'm going to give you a note to W.H. Melchoir, the
> > chief train dispatcher at Beliot, and send you over to take your
> > examination. Eddie says you have your block rules learned okay and you can
> > read the train wire. They need operators and you are good enough to start
> > out."
> >
> > Next day I rode the morning local passenger train to Beliot. Mr. Melchoir
> > examined me and sent me to Burlington to work that very night. There was no
> > physical or standard rules examination at that time, but you had to know
> > the
> > block rules. You had to know how to ask the man east of you for a "47"
> > before you let an eastbound train into the block, etc. A "block" was the
> > stretch of track between your office and his, and "47" meant "Will hold all
> > westbound trains until your train arrives."
> >
> > Because the Morse train dispatcher had to work fast in order to keep his
> > trains moving, there came into use so many abbreviations that if, as you
> > sat
> > in the wayside station waiting-room listening to the sounders, you could
> > have to read every letter that was passing over the train wire, you still
> > would have been unable to know what was going on, unless you understood the
> > code. You might have heard the dispatcher and the op converse as follows:
> > "Sa wn x w cmg ma hv 9 r tm." snaps the dispatcher. {Say when extra west
> > train is coming. I may have orders for them.}
> >
> > "Art tnk c tr smk no," returns the op. "Es hr ty cm ty in ste nw."
> > {All right. I think I see their smoke now. Yes, here they come. They are in
> > sight now.}
> >
> > "U gt nytng r em." asks the DS. {Have you got anything for them?}
> >
> > "Es abt 15 m wk," replies the operator. {Yes, about 15 minutes work.}
> >
> > "OK 31 cy 3 r em & let me kw hw mch wk ty gt at DR b4 c clr em ma hv
> > to chg tt meet wi 42 No 7s ab 20 m1 I'll hnd hm sm ti on tm at DR."
> > {Okay. Make 3 copies on a 31 order for them and let me know how much
> > work they've got at Darienbefore you clear them. May have to change that
> > meet with number 42. Number 7 is about twenty minutes late. I'll hand him
> > some time on them at Darien.}
> >
> > Hour after hour, with occasional periods of rest, twenty-four hours a day,
> > the sounder rattled on, Few words were spelled out in train movement
> > conversation, as this language -- the "cut" language of the old Morse train
> > wire -- clicked over the line.
> >
> > All railroad offices with telephone dispatcher's wire equipment have a
> > Morse circuit to fall back on in case of trouble on the phone wire. The
> > young operators dread this. If they happen to be working with an old Morse
> > dispatcher, they are in hot water trying to read his abbreviated
> > instructions. To a veteran, however, it's the old familiar code.
> >
> > Morse men admit that the telephone, like the typewriter, makes for greater
> > efficiency. It standardizes operations, saves time and work, and diminishes
> > the hazards of the iron trail. But we of the old school miss the romance of
> > the earlier days of rugged individualism when you reached for a brass key
> > instead of a black telephone receiver, and were proud of the bold, rapid,
> > flowing strokes with which you wrote your train orders by hand.
> >
> > And if a tobacco-chewing boomer op were suddenly yanked out of the dim past
> > and put to work on a teletype machine, his consternation would be equalled
> > only by his profanity. Teletypes are doing their bit to make
> > Morse a dead language. So far, you'll find 'em on only a few of the big
> > roads. The latest pike to install this system is the Erie, which is now
> > using teletype machines for their consist and passing report systems.
> >
> > As every rail knows the consist of a freight train includes all of its
> > car numbers, listed in order, beginning at the head end. For each carload
> > are shown contents, tons, destination, route (including other roads, if any
> > such are needed to take the car to its destination), and sometimes the name
> > of the consignee. Ventilation, refrigeration, or heating instructions are
> > shown for perishable freight, and when livestock was last fed and rested.
> >
> > All this information, in the case of the Erie, is transmitted by teletype
> > to
> > the company's general offices at Chicago, Cleveland, and New York, and to
> > the district office at Jersey City, NJ, immediately after hotshot freights
> > have left the yards. There, centralized tracking bureaus use the
> > information
> > to answer quickly all shipper and receiver inquiries about the movement of
> > cars -- inquiries that in days gone by were answered with the aid of Morse
> > conversation.
> >
> > A friend on the Erie tells me that when his company adopted teletypes for
> > its consist and passing report systems, last March, it converted 845 miles
> > of telegraph wire to printer circuits, making a total of 2,320 miles of
> > these circuits now in operation on the Erie. Of this total, he says, 2,075
> > miles are equipped with duplex apparatus over which messages or consists
> > can
> > be sent in both directions at the same time.
> >
> > Morse experts concede that the telephone, the typewriter and the teletype
> > seldom fail and, as I pointed out, do the work more easily and more
> > rapidly.
> > Few train dispatchers and ops would go back to the obsolete system if they
> > could. But now and then you'll run across a mellow old boomer who sighs for
> > the snappy Morse dialogue on the dispatcher's wire that is fast becoming a
> > lost language.
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
>
>
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
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