The C&S switchers, which were in Denver where the C&S did the switching (it was the C&S's yard), were lettered C&S/AT&SF. The Santa Fe switchers, which were to the south where the Santa Fe did the switching (it was the Santa Fe's yard), were lettered AT&SF/C&S. In a nutshell, the owner was on top.
Richard Townsend
Lincoln City, OR
-----Original Message-----
From: LZadnichek@aol.com [CBQ] <CBQ@yahoogroups.com>
To: cbq <cbq@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Wed, Feb 1, 2017 11:18 am
Subject: Re: [CBQ] Re: 1952 flooding [1 Attachment]
February 1, 2017
John - The image might be misidentified as to location (it occasionally
happens....). That being said, from your comments, the Santa Fe 0-8-0 might well
have been photographed in Pueblo. Can anyone else in our Group tell anything
from the minimal background in the image? Also, I wasn't aware of the "reversed
lettering" for Denver and Pueblo that you describe. I checked some of the
C&S images I have and found this undated one of C&S 608 at Denver,CO,
with the lettered as you stated for Denver-based locomotives. I have both
inserted and attached the image:
I wonder why the lettering was one way in Denver and another way in Pueblo?
There must be an interesting story behind all this. Unless some one can
convince me otherwise, I'll go ahead and change the location for the Santa Fe
0-8-0 from Denver to Pueblo. Thanks and best regards - Louis
Louis Zadnichek II
Fairhope, AL
Interesting that it's marked as being in Denver, I've always thought
C&S did the switching for ATSF in Denver and ATSF did the switching for
C&S in Pueblo. That was the reason C&S lettering was on top, and in
Pueblo the ATSF was above the C&S. Not sure why a SF 0-6-0 would be
in Denver ?
-----
Original Message -----
Sent:
Wednesday, February 01, 2017 9:39 AM
Subject:
Re: [CBQ] Re: 1952 flooding [1 Attachment]
February 1,
2017
Mark/Hol - Very much appreciate both your comments and recollections
including the images of the PA's on the Q! All very interesting. I'm
going to contribute an image of Santa Fe 0-8-0 type No. 854 lettered for the
joint switching entity AT&SF C&S. Whereas I've got a number of
images showing C&S 2-8-0's so lettered, this is the only one I've come
across to date of a Santa Fe steam locomotive so lettered. I've
both inserted and attached the image that's dated 1951 and
identified as being at Denver.
I do not recall the joint switching entity being featured in the BRHS
Bulletin, so maybe this thread can be the basis for such an article in the
future. Same for the 1952 flooding and subsequent detouring. If both
subjects have been covered previously, then forgive me as I'm
developing a case of "old timers disease" since my memory is not quite as
sharp as it once was. My Dad was C&S southern division trainmaster at
Trinidad, CO, during 1951-52 and I still well remember watching Santa
Fe steam on Raton Pass. Those wonderful memories still remain clear as
can be.... Best Regards - Louis
Louis Zadnichek II
Fairhope, AL
Greetings everyone,
Otto Perry took the following
still images of the ATSF on the Q;
OP-2194 7/15/51 Alco PA #68+
Derby CO 13 cars @ 55mph
OP-2196 7/15/51 Alco PA #75+ 'The
Chief' Derby CO 13 cars @ 70mph
Otto took several stills on the
Joint Line on the same day.
And other days too, in July
1951.
If Mr Perry was there, it is
possible that Mr Kindig was there too.
Because of the 1951 emergency
all diesels were pressed into service pulling the back log from CA
east.
Very unlikely that any
steamers went east over the Q at that time.
After 1953 steam was rare on
the Joint Line.
I am uncertain as to who
crewed the detoured diesels over the Q in 1951. My guess would be ATSF
enginemen with a CB&Q crew acting as pilots.
Part of the negotiations were
not only between the ATSF and the CB&Q, but also between the local
committees of the engineers, firemen and trainmen. No wonder it took time
to organize the detours.
I am not aware of images of
ATSF steamers on the Q.
Having said that I can say
that ATSF steamers sometimes ran over the C&S's Denver-Colorado
Springs line.
Given the close relationship
between the ATSF and the CB&Q, and given that emergencies did
sometimes arise, it is possible that ATSF steamers did run over the Q.
In Superior NE, ATSF engines
ran over CB&Q tracks for a short distance switching and turning t
rains.
Incidentally, C&S engine
men ran ATSF steamers, as called, over the Joint Line in the early years
due to the unique Joint Operating Agreement and the labour agreements in
force at the time. And ATSF crews C&S trains.
Thank you all for your
excellent contributions to date. :-)
Oh, yes. Otto Perry's
"Santa Fe" is on CD. Mostly diesels but many steamers; exceptional
photography!
Mark
[Unable to
display image]
January 31, 2017
Mark and Hol - Did the Santa Fe (Uncle Pete to you real old
timers....) run their own steam locomotives on detoured trains over the Q?
Sometime in the past, I've seen images of Santa Fe diesel streamliners
detouring, but I've never seen an image of a Santa Fe steam locomotive
running over the Q east of Denver, or west from Chicago for that
matter. Did Otto Perry or any others photograph any such scenes?
Best Regards - Louis
Louis Zadnichek II
Fairhope, AL
[Unable to
display image]
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Posted by: Richard Townsend <richtownsend@netscape.net>
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