The CZ consists are at:
http://www.drgw.org/data/passenger/CZConsists.pdf
At first glance, the file appears useless as it is impossible to read - at
that size.
The reasons for picking the size have to do with how PDF works and how the
CZ consists were developed. PDF files are essentially "printed" to files -
so making them scrollable right to left is not doable (for me).
The solution is to print it all quite small, and when the view wishes to
look at it, modify the ratio of viewing within PDF. However, most attempts
to do so this morning have not been very successful. Not sure if there is
a problem with the server, comcast, or where.
I *DO* want to find a better method of presenting these and other consists
- any suggestions would be welcome.
Also, remember that there is a lightweight passenger car list at:
http://www.drgw.org/data/passenger/lightweight.pdf
if there are any missing lw cars from the Q there, I would like to know
ASAP. There is also a Excel spreadsheet if anyone wants it in that
format, it would help in questions like "what obs were owned by CB&Q".
What *could* be done is to print the CZ & DZ consists in a forthcoming
Zephyr or Bulletin insert. However, I would somewhat have to insist that
the information also be shared for publication (or dissemination to) the
other two HS's that have contributed information.
I have over 200 CZ and some Zephyr service consists, and only 17 DZ
consists. I also have the foreign car lists (that is, the cars that are
in the CZ consists of foreign railroads with the related model information
and such. In this way when the BLI CZ comes out, you could also know that
there are (at least) 61 cars that can be modeled from ATSF, B&O, C&O, CB&Q,
D&RGW, CRI&P, IC, L&N, MILW, NYC, PRR, NKP, ACL, SP & UP that are
documented in specific consists and that can be modeled easily in HO.
I plan on writing an article in the near future for the Prospector on this
topic - but it obviously includes the other two roads. The supporting
information (consists, tabular modeling information, photos) could easily
be assembled into something usable for all three.
As always, additional information on these subjects is always welcomed.
At 09:26 AM 4/28/2005, you wrote:
>Bob, Charlie, and Others:
>
>Perhaps I can help clarify the issue.
>
>1.) The DZ normally carried a baggage car and an RPO, as Bob
>listed in his consists.
>
>2.) Once a week, Bob check the date and day if possible, of the
>DZ consists with the two cars of magazines, I think it was
>Saturday. These cars were weekly news magazines printed in
>Chicago for distribution from Denver.
>
>3.) I do not know what Charlie means be the real CZ. Was there
>a fantasy CZ???
>
>4.) Lets not think in terms of sections of the CZ for this subject.
>Those sections were traffic created by the Passenger
>Department to develop Chicago to Denver business, usually fall
>color ro ski tourism. The were not passed to the DRG&W or WP.
>
>5.) A bit of history is needed to understand why mail cars were
>added at Omaha or Lincoln. Do you recall The Coloradoan? It
>was primarily a mail and express train coaches and some meal
>and beverage service. When that train was removed, the
>business did not disappear. The Chicago to Omaha - Lincoln
>M&E was added to the Nebraska Zephyr. Since the Q had a
>contract to move a car or so from Lincoln or Omaha to Denver,
>guess where they were placed? On the CZ.
>
>6.) Why the CZ? After the Coloradoan was discontinued, the Q
>operated only three trains to Denver, the DZ, CZ, and 7. Seven
>was too slow and Numbers 1 and 10, the DZ were the premier
>trains on the CB&Q. They were not to be tampered with. So, by
>default and somewhat unhappily, the decision was made to add
>the business to the CZ.
>
>7. In this era and for the same reasson, a car was also added to
>the westbound and removed from the eastbound CZ at Brush.
>This was the Alliance - Denver car.
>
>Ed DeRouin
>
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>--- In CBQ@yahoogroups.com, Bob Webber <no17@c...> wrote:
> > No... that was the interesting part. All of the CZ's that had this
>traffic
> > were 1st section CZ's - and had the traffic added at Omaha
>and/or
> > "Lincoln". Remember that Omaha was late night, and Denver
>early morning,
> > power changed at Denver. So slipping all extra head end off at
>Denver
> > would have been rather easy. BTW, year was 1966.
> >
> > At 12:32 AM 4/28/2005, you wrote:
> > >Bob-
> > >Weren't the CZs with headend traffic all, or mostly all, "2nd"
>CZ, which
> > >someone stated actually ran on the DZ schedule? I saw a
>number of the
> > >consists that had an attempt at assembling a CZ, but with
>RPOs, etc.. but
> > >never more than one baggage (sometimes a economy
>baggage subing for one of
> > >the CZ cars) on the real CZ.
> > >Charlie Vlk
> > >
> > >----- Original Message -----
> > >From: "Bob Webber" <no17@c...>
> > >To: <CBQ@yahoogroups.com>
> > >Sent: Wednesday, April 27, 2005 8:12 AM
> > >Subject: Re: [CBQ] DZ Et Al Head End Info Needed
> > >
> > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > I have a few consists of the DZ for May of 64 that include
>head end.
> > > >
> > > > Interestingly, when I was looking into the CZ consist
>information, a LOT
> > >of
> > > > headend traffic was added between Omaha (and Lincoln)
>and Denver. Why not
> > > > the DZ, or other sections of the DZ, I don't know. But often
>as many as 3
> > > > extra cars. From Cicero, on the DZ several times there are
>labels
> > > > indicating magazine loaded baggage cars. If interested, I
>can post those
> > > > ....
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > At 12:31 AM 4/27/2005, you wrote:
> > > >
> > > > >Hi all,
> > > > >
> > > > >Sorry I couldn't make the Spring Meet recently but my
>nephew got married
> > > > >that day.
> > > > >
> > > > >Now to my question . . . I have roster info for the Denver
>Zephyr but
> > > > >recently heard that it carried quite a bit of head end cars,
>too. That
> > > > >got me wondering what typically those cars would be --
>RPO, mail storage
> > > > >in baggage, express box cars/ex-troop cars, and in what
>quantities or in
> > > > >any special order, so that I can make a reasonably
>accurate
> > >representation
> > > > >in my modeling, which will be on a "Prototype-freelanced"
>Burlington
> > >based
> > > > >layout in HO set "somewhere" between Chicago and
>Galesburg.
> > > > >
> > > > >I know that the CZ didn't apparently carry any of these type
>cars in it's
> > > > >train. Also would appreciate same info for the NZ and any
>other
> > > > >Burlington passenger trains running between CUS and
>Galesburg...or beyond
> > > > >(sorry, I don't have my reference info handy but IIRC there
>were only 4-6
> > > > >in the late 1960's). I realize the mail contracts were lost
>in, was it
> > > > >1967, but I'm using my "modeler's license" to bend history
>a bit on the
> > >layout.
> > > > >
> > > > >Thanks a lot, guys, for any help on this.
> > > > >
> > > > >P.S.
> > > > >For Gerald: LHS stand for local hobby shop!
> > > > >
> > > > >Paul (Kossart) - "The CB&Q Guy"
> > > > >Peru, IL *USA*
> > > > >Modeling 1960's in HO.
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >Yahoo! Groups Links
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > > Bob Webber
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Yahoo! Groups Links
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >Yahoo! Groups Links
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> > Bob Webber
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
Bob Webber
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