Re: [CBQ] Q Heavy-Duty depressed center flat car

["Douglas Hosler" <dehosler@frontier.com>]

Thank you for the discussion of per diem rates and whether they were too low or too high.  I wonder what the home railroad was for refrigerator cars when the refrigerator car company was owned by more than one railroad, such as the PFE.  My dad was a traveling agent for PFE (out of Chicago) form 1945 to 1960 or so.  It seemed to me his main job was not checking on icings but rather visiting yard offices (making a circuit in an area over the ear) to find the PFE cars that were being held.  It did not seem a priority of the railroads anywhere, so far as I could tell, to return the cars.

Doug Hosler    

On August 3, 2016 at 10:27:11 AM, Leo Phillipp via Groups.Io (qutlx1=aol.com@groups.io) wrote:

Per Diem rates were/are set by a formula that factors in the building cost of the car ,its age and of course market demand for the car type. This is done through an AAR committee/bureau. 

When I worked in the BN Chicago Regional Office there was still a pamphlet from the 1950s explaining per diem and stressing how important it was to get that foreign car off Q rails prior to midnight in order to save a days per diem charge.

What Ted mentions is overall true. Car owners generally felt that per diems were too low and those holding and using the cars felt they were too high(or at least said that publicly). Keep in mind that per diem only applies to Railroad marked cars,not private cars that have an 'X' as the last reporting mark. Those cars are handled by a totally separate system of mileage compensation and tank cars by an even more complicated system called "equalization".

Even today there are hundreds, no thousands, of box cars wearing a RR reporting mark that are actually owned by a leasing company,bank,financial institution, etc. that are running on what's  called a per diem lease. The true car owner gets compensated when the car is off the line of the RR who's mark it is wearing. Today these tend to be older cars running out their final years.

Just think of the effect Precision Railroading should have on per diem, at least in theory !

Leo Phillipp

On Aug 3, 2019, at 9:45 AM, Ted Schnepf <railsunl@sbcglobal.net> wrote:

Hello everyone,

I am going to question John's statement about per diem.  Someone more knowledgeable should comment and correct

During the '60's and '70's, when working for the railroad, I always understood per diem rates were very low and not worth the cost of the equipment.  East coast RR's were notorious for hording western roads equipment, because per diem was cheaper than building cars for themselves.  Possibly special duty flat cars had more worthwhile per diem rates?

I would assume the Q had the special duty flats so they could participate in the pool and in long hauls the pool created of over size loads.  The loads were probably on a foreign  flat car, but were good profitable  revenue moves.

Hoping someone with knowledge of per diem and rates will comment.

Agree with John, the CBQ flat was seldom on Q rails.

Ted Schnepf

126 Will Scarlet,

Elgin, Ill. 60120

847=697-5353

On Friday, August 2, 2019, 10:44:56 PM CDT, John Mitchell via Groups.Io <icrr1680=yahoo.com@groups.io> wrote:

The heavy duty flat cars of the various railroads were in a sort of nationwide pool ran by the AAR Car Service Bureau. Since they spent most of the time, off home rails and the owning road collected per diem, they were money makers for their owners!

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