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Re: [CBQ] Re: New North Star trains

To: "cvlk@comcast.net" <cvlk@comcast.net>
Subject: Re: [CBQ] Re: New North Star trains
From: Stephen Levine <sjl_prodigynet@yahoo.com>
Date: Wed, 18 Nov 2009 15:28:02 -0800 (PST)
Cc: "CBQ@yahoogroups.com" <CBQ@yahoogroups.com>
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In your studies, how reliable have you found the dates in Richard C. 
Overton&#39;s Burlington Route book?  I would think that, because it was 
written by an academician working from company records, it would be as accurate 
as possible, at least as the compny records would allow. However, I would 
appreciate hearing your take on the book.

Charlie Vlk wrote: 
>    
>       Robert, Bill and all.... 
> The exact details of the early service of the CB&Q into Chicago have not been 
> fully researched and some of the published information is at odds with other 
> information. 
> For example, most published sources show the IC Chicago Branch not being 
> completed until September 27, 1856, but the St. Charles Air Line was 
> completed to connect with the IC and its station prior to that date.  It may 
> be that the line was in use south of Chicago to some point and the Michigan 
> Central was already using the IC to get into Chicago. 
> More research has to be done to tie in these events. 
> The temporary terminus of the Chicago and Aurora operating over the St. 
> Charles Air Line to the west bank of the South Branch at 14th Street has not 
> been published. 
> Also, after (or during) the building of the Chicago and Aurora main line to 
> Aurora it appears there may have been a north from Hawthorne to a connection 
> to the Galena & Chicago Union main line at 42nd Street (at that time their 
> shops and main yard).  This "Chicago & North Western Cut-Off predates the 
> Chicago Union Terminal / Belt Railway of Chicago by decades and appears on at 
> least one 1872 map.   When the C&A opened its own line the Galena & abandoned 
> the western part of the Air Line from Harlem to Western Avenue and built the 
> "Robey Street Connector" to gain direct access from its main line down to the 
> Air Line and its important dock facilities on the Chicago River (including 
> the properties that were the Potato Yard and now Global 1). 
> The first railroad in the State of Illinois was the Northern Cross and its 
> first locomotive was put into service on November 8, 1838. 
> The Galena & Chicago Union was the first line into Chicago in 1848. 
> The Aurora Branch is completed to Turner Junction October 21, 1850 with 
> trackage rights to Chicago over Galena & Chicago Union. 
> The IC was completed into Chicago on September 27, 1856. 
> The Galena & Chicago Union purchased the track of the bankrupted Chicago, St. 
> Charles and Mississippi Air Line from Chicago to the DesPlaines River on 
> April 10, 1854 and prompltly  built a connecting track  from its main line at 
> Harlem (Oak Park) to connect with the St. Charles Air Line.   Some Chicago 
> and Aurora trains were diverted from the C&GU main at that point and used the 
> St.Charles Air Line to a station on the Chicago River at about 14th Street.   
> Later, in 1855, construction started on a Draw Span Bridge across the South 
> Branch of the Chicago River and on March 30, 1856 the eastward connection 
> from the bridge to the Illinois Central station grounds on the Lakefront was 
> completed and Chicago and Aurora trains started using that station. 
> The Chicago and Aurora opened its own main line May 20, 1864. 
> An interesting tidbit that hasn't been widely shared to my knowlege.... .   
> CB&Q commuter service once was divided at Riverside.   The trains that made 
> local stops between Chicago and Riverside terminated there.   Trains that 
> made stops between Riverside and Aurora and beyond were operated express to 
> Riverside.   So, say you wanted to go from Lawndale Avenue to Westmont.... .. 
> you had to change trains at Riverside to do so!    The trains that  provided 
> service west of Riverside often continued on to points beyond and were not 
> part of the "commuter fleet" but rather regular local accomodation trains.   
> This practice ceased when Riverside was discontinued as a engine terminal and 
> coach yard in favor of Downers Grove. 
> Also, the Illinois Central originally had no direct line into Chicago and its 
> trains from East Dubuque used trackage rights over the CB&Q.  At first the 
> trains used the IC all the way down to Mendota, then later they had a line 
> that connected to the Q at Forreston.  The  IC took forever to build the 
> direct line from East Dubuque to Chicago, the Chicago, Madison & Northern, 
> and they used routings over the CGW to regain their own tracks (the Iowa 
> Division).   The last segment to be finished was the Clyde-Chicago segment 
> that connected with the St. Charles Air Line and it was so delayed that the 
> line had a direct (grade level???) connection at the crossing of the CB&Q at 
> La Verne. 
> Charlie Vlk 
> ----- Original Message ----- 
>   From: William Barber 
>   To: CBQ@yahoogroups. com 
>   Sent: Wednesday, November 18, 2009 9:51 AM 
>   Subject: [CBQ] Re: New North Star trains 
> Robert, 
> Q commuter service in Chicago started in 1864 (the centennial train 
>   was operated in 1964 pulled by 4-8-4 #5632 painted gold.). I don't 
>   know when the very first commuter service started in the Chicago 
>   area, but it was certainly earlier than the Q. I suspect it may have 
>   been either the C&NW or the IC. 
> Bill Barber 
>   Gravois Mills, MO 
> On Nov 18, 2009, at 3:29 AM, CBQ@yahoogroups. com wrote: 
>> New North Star trains 
>   > Posted by: "ROBERT K SORENSEN" rksmes@q.com tcdbob 
>   > Tue Nov 17, 2009 7:08 pm (PST) 
>   > 
>   > 
>   > 
>   > 
>   > Group- Lots of "fuss" here in Twin Cities regarding the start-up of 
>   > the North Star heavy rail trains on the BNSF tracks. 
>   > 
>   > It is almost like the wheel has been reinvented! 
>   > 
>   > Will someone give me the year that commuter service started in 
>   > Chicago? Not necessarily CB&Q but I know that they started many 
>   > years ago and are still going. 
> ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- - 
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>      



      


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