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[CBQ] Re: [DRGW] Re: Hudsons on the Joint Line

To: DRGW@yahoogroups.com, cbq@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [CBQ] Re: [DRGW] Re: Hudsons on the Joint Line
From: Norm Metcalf <n.metcalf@worldnet.att.net>
Date: Thu, 21 Aug 2008 08:22:50 -0600
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HOL WAGNER wrote:
> Norm:
>  
> You might want to post this:
>  
> Re: this discussion of a few days ago of Q Hudsons on the C&S, 
> specifically the Joint Line.  It simply did not happen.  In fact, the 
> only time a Q Hudson operated on the C&S was on June 22, 1937, when no 
> less than newly streamlined S-4-A 4000 "Aeolus" pulled the summer 
> inaugural run of trains 25-26, the /Buffalo Bill/, between Denver and 
> Cody, Wyo.  The seven-car train would have been no problem for the 
> 78-inch-drivered Hudson, but the grades and curves of the line north of 
> Denver would certainly have kept "Alice" from exercising her full 
> potential.  Maximum speed would have been only between 50 and 60 mph.
>  
> As for the Joint Line south of Denver, no S-4s ever operated over the 
> route.  But the C&S did lease several Q B-1-A 4-8-2s during the 
> 1930s-40s for use in passenger service between Denver and Trinidad.  And 
> on a single occasion, a pair of Q O-5-A Northerns made the run south 
> from Denver all the way to Dallas -- for the New Year's Day 1938 Cotton 
> Bowl in which Rice (Houston) defeated the University of Colorado 28-14.  
> Two special trains, each powered by a new O-5-A, took Buffs fans from 
> Denver to the game and back home.
>  
> Hol Wagner
> 
>     
>     Mark Sellars wrote:
>      > Greetings All,
>      > 
>      > The 4-6-4s were largely built for speed on passenger trains.
>      > They did not cope all that well on the 74 ft in the mile ruling
>     grade up to Palmer Lake.
>      > 
>      > And yes, the C&S and FW&D engines were not infrequent visitors on
>     the Q.
>      > But they were not 'speedsters' and would not, I would guess, be
>     power of choice on anything but secondary passenger or freight trains.
>      > 
>      > The Aeolus was specifically built for powering a Zephyr run for
>     when a train set or engine was out of service; hence the stream lining.
>      > 
>      > The C&S frequently leased Q steam power for freight trains and
>     these ran between Denver and points south.
>      > 
>      > Bob, thanks for the extra information on the Q. Personally I do
>     not know a great deal about the Q but am always willing to learn.
>      > 
>      > Regards, Mark
>      >
>      > ----- Original Message ----
>      > From: Bob Webber <rgz17@comcast.net <mailto:rgz17@comcast.net>>
>      > To: DRGW@yahoogroups.com <mailto:DRGW@yahoogroups.com>
>      > Sent: Sunday, August 17, 2008 12:54:23 PM
>      > Subject: Re: [DRGW] Re: Hudsons on the Joint Line
>      >
>      >
>      > Well... remember that the joint line was operated by the C&S - not
>      > the CB&Q. And the C&S had their own stable of locomotives. It
>      > would be far more likely to see a FW&D locomotive than a Q one on
>     the
>      > Joint Line. And, though you never say never - I'd bet it didn't
>      > happen except in extreme situations if at all.
>      >
>      > The 4-6-4's were used well past the Zephyr era - as that started
>     with
>      > the Pioneer Zephyr in the early 30's, and the 4-6-4s were running on
>      > the Expo well into the late '40s. Too, they'd still be seen on the
>      > Coloradoan and other "2nd tier" trains well after the Zephyr era
>     started.
>      >
>      > The two Aeolus locomotives (Alice the Goons) were used on multiple
>      > Zephyrs, so not just "the Zephyr". In fact most runs were on the
>      > Twin Cities - more so than the DZ, or other Zephyr. Though there are
>      > photos of the King & Queen being on the Expo and E5s or Os on the DZ
>      > - Aeolus was not typically kept for that run.
>      >
>      > Aeolus & the Colorado Southern did have something in common - Aeolus
>      > is "the keep of the winds" and Boreas (as in the Pass) is the North
>      > Wind (Zephyrus being the West Wind).
>      >
>      > At 10:13 PM 8/16/2008, you wrote:
>      >> The CB&Q frequently operated 4-6-4s between Chicago and Denver in
>      >> the pre-zephyr era. And used the "Aeolus" when the Zephyr was
>     out of action.
>      >> But as far as I know these engines did not venture onto to the
>     Joint Line.
>      >> Regards, Mark
>      >
>      > Bob Webber
>      >
>      >


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