I am looking for the late 1950's thru 1970. While I was riding trains before
then (my first trip at 3 months of age on the DZ in 1949, that was when I
remember a lot of my dome experience.
sjl
homanfamily <homanfamily@fuse.net> wrote:
What period are your looking for? I have a 1921 and 1951 Rule books.
Pat Homan
----- Original Message -----
From: "Stephen J. Levine" <sjl@prodigy.net>
To: <CBQ@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, July 10, 2007 6:00 PM
Subject: [CBQ] SIgnals on the Q
> As you can see below, an interesting discussion is occurring on the
> NYC-Railroad list about signal practices.
>
> What were the practices on the Q for block signals and interlocking
> signals in terms of the types of signals used. My personal observations
> were that, at least with Lines West, signals governing sidings were
> head-offset target signals, whereas those governing blocks were vertical
> tri-light signals. Interlocking signals, if I were remember, were also
> target signals.
>
> I am hoping this post, with the inclusion of the post below, will inspire
> someone to write about signaling practices on the Burlington. I remember,
> as a teenager, riding in a dome on the DZ as a fellow explained
> signalling. Unfortunately, I did not understand a lot of it, although, as
> a dome rider, I had been interested in the signal bridges as part of the
> overall experience. I would like to revisit those memories with some
> additional insight into what I was seeing and why.
>
> sjl
>
> "Stephen J. Levine" <sjl@prodigy.net> wrote:
> To: NYC-Railroad@yahoogroups.com
> From: "Stephen J. Levine" <sjl@prodigy.net>
> Date: Tue, 10 Jul 2007 09:32:19 -0700 (PDT)
> Subject: Re: [NYC-Railroad] SIgnal "Rules" For NYC System Railroads
>
> I always wondered by some signals had offset heads and some did
> not.
>
> Was that generally standard for all railroads where the block signals had
> offset heads and the interlocking signals were vertical?
>
> aschneiderjr@sbcglobal.net wrote:
> Right, my mistake. Alex
>
> On 9 Jul 2007 at 17:15, Richard Stoving wrote:
>
>> Alex,
>> Nice summary, but didn't you mean to write that interlocking signals had
>> a vertical arrangement, while block (stop and proceed) signals had
>> offset heads?
>> Rich
>>
>> aschneiderjr@sbcglobal.net wrote:
>>
>> > Ken,
>> >
>> > Although initially each railroad wrote its own rules, coordination
>> > began during
>> > the 1880s. A "standard rulebook" was written, although each railroad
>> > could,
>> > and did, adapt it for its own needs. Rules 281 and following,
>> > governing
>> > signals, were commonly condensed to omit aspects which a particular
>> > railroad did not use, and the illustrations depicted semaphores, color
>> > lights /
>> > searchlights, or position lights depending on the style(s) used by
>> > that
>> > railroad. The NYC used most of the standard aspects; you should look
>> > for a
>> > NYC rule book at a train show for specific information. The two
>> > editions
>> > commonly available are ca. 1938 and 1956. Stickers showing rule
>> > changes
>> > subsequent to publication are often pasted on appropriate pages.
>> >
>> > As the New York Central was formed by mergers between 1914 and 1936 of
>> >
>> > independent railroads which had developed signal systems
>> > independently,
>> > the answer to your question depends on WHAT portion of the NYC you
>> > model and WHEN. I will try to give a short overview.
>> >
>> > First, you need to understand the difference between BLOCK and
>> > INTERLOCKING signals. Block signals are spaced along main lines to
>> > keep
>> > a following train from running into one preceding it, while
>> > interlocking signals
>> > are installed where multiple routes and/or crossings are controlled by
>> > a
>> > tower operator. The most restrictive aspect of a block signal is "Stop
>> > and
>> > proceed", while the most restrictive aspect of an interlocking signal
>> > is "Stop".
>> > Block signals on the NYC had a number plate denoting the mileage from
>> > a
>> > particular point, such as Buffalo in the case of the main line from
>> > Buffalo to
>> > Chicago. Interlocking signals did not have number plates.
>> >
>> > Semaphore signals were the first to be developed and most signals were
>> >
>> > initially of that type. Color light signals and "searchlight" signals
>> > began to
>> > appear around the time of World War I. The former had a separate bulb
>> > and
>> > lens for each color to be displayed by that head (normally green,
>> > yellow and
>> > red), while the searchlight had a single bulb and lens and a
>> > mechanical
>> > "spectacle" between the bulb and the lens so the correct color was
>> > displayed. The color light was cheaper to maintain, but the
>> > searchlight was
>> > thought to be safer because incident sunlight could not be reflected
>> > back
>> > and give a misleading indication. The Michigan Central (Chicago -
>> > Detroit -
>> > Buffalo) and Lines East (Buffalo - New York) liked searchlights, the
>> > Lines
>> > West (Chicago - Cleveland - Detroit) liked color lights, typically in
>> > a triangle
>> > arrangement. You need localized information here. Semaphores were
>> > still in
>> > widespread use into the 1940s.
>> >
>> > If a signal was to display more than three aspects, two or three heads
>> > were
>> > used. In the case of a block signal they were arranged in a vertical
>> > line and
>> > normally three heads were used, while in the case of an interlocking
>> > signal
>> > the upper one was offset to the left and the lower one to the right
>> > and
>> > normally two heads were used. When a fourth block signal aspect was
>> > used
>> > it was typically ADVANCE APPROACH; my impression is that this level of
>> >
>> > signalling was only used on multi-track main lines.
>> >
>> > Interlocking signals were common at junctions even on routes whose
>> > traffic
>> > did not justify block signals along the main line. A simple, yet
>> > fairly complete,
>> > understanding of interlocking signals is to think of the top head as
>> > governing
>> > normal speed track beyond the signal, the middle head as governing
>> > medium speed, and the bottom head as governing low speed. If no track
>> > of
>> > a given speed existed beyond the signal, the corresponding head would
>> > be
>> > red at all times. So a block signal in advance of a slow speed
>> > diverging route
>> > into a yard might have a three aspect head in the top position, a
>> > red-only
>> > "dummy" in the middle position, and a two aspect head allowing only
>> > red and
>> > yellow in the bottom position. When the diverging route was lined, the
>> > best
>> > signal available was "restricting", which in essence meant, you're on
>> > your
>> > own, watch for other traffic, broken rails, misalligned switches or
>> > anything
>> > else. A signal governing a route into a siding might substitute a
>> > three aspect
>> > head on the bottom if block protection thru the siding was provided.
>> >
>> > Hope this didn't exceed your interest level. Signals add a lot of
>> > interest but
>> > interlocking signals, in particular, can be complex.
>> >
>> > Alex Schneider
>> >
>> > On 9 Jul 2007 at 11:21, Ken Leaver Jr wrote:
>> >
>> > > I have a copy a friend gave to me years ago of what I believe to be
>> > an
>> > > Model Railroader Article titled "The ABC's of prototype Signaling"
>> > by
>> > > Gordon Odegard. It lists a bunch of rules such as Rule 281: Name
>> > Clear,
>> > > Indication Proceed. My question is, who set these rules? The FRA???
>> > And
>> > > if so, I presume then the NYC followed them? If not, what did the
>> > NYC
>> > > use for its' signal aspects. In particular, for STOP,
>> > PROCEED-PREPARE
>> > > TO STOP, PROCEED AT RESTRICTED SPEED and STOP.
>> > >
>> > > I want to keep my Signal Aspects simple, so I don't plan on using
>> > that
>> > > many, 3 or 4 at the most. For certain, I want STOP, PROCEED-PREPARE
>> > TO
>> > > STOP, and CLEAR. The fourth on might be PROCEED AT RESTRICTED SPEED,
>> >
>> > > but on a model railroad that seems rather redundant. Is there a
>> > signal
>> > > aspect that I am missing that might be useful on a model railroad?
>> > Is
>> > > the fourth aspect needed? Especially those who model and operate
>> > > something following the NYC Prototype, what do you use? I would like
>> > to
>> > > use Type-G signals. Is there any other information I need to provide
>> > so
>> > > my questions can be answered?
>> > >
>> > > Thanks for any info and help!
>> > >
>> > > Ken L.
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>> > >
>> > >
>> >
>> >
>>
>>
>> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>>
>>
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