Hol, All this correspondence on the reuse of old coaches reminds me
of a question concerning the use of an old coach as a yard office at
Keokuk. I was in this old coach several times when we picked up and
set out. The last few times they were scraping the car and I recall
looking up above the drop ceiling that was in the coach and at the end
of the car in the arched panel above the doors was the letters
BURLINGTON in beautiful gold leaf paint. How I wish I could have cut
out those two panels and saved them. I also wish I had looked for
some type of number also. Old head switchman told me that car was
there when he came home from WW2. Any other news about this coach?
On Nov 8, 2011, at 5:09 PM, HOL WAGNER wrote:
>
> Here's the last of the passenger car related correspondence from the
> CRRM library.
>
> Background: In August 1934, in the depths of the Great Depression,
> the Q converted three old (1906-07) Pullman wooden dining cars (143,
> 145-146) that had earlier been steel sheathed into dining-lounge
> cars numbered 330-332. Such conversions were routinely done to
> dining cars by simply removing the tables/chairs farthest from the
> kitchen and replacing them with overstuffed lounge chairs. But this
> conversion was of a more permanent nature and included adding
> windows in the end of the cars so they could function as "poor
> man's" solarium observation cars. Their first assignment was to the
> Gulf Coast Special of the C&S-FW&D between Denver and Fort Worth. At
> some point the movable lounge chairs may have been replaced by
> fixed, rotating parlor chairs, because by the time of the
> correspondence below, they were referred to as parlor-dining cars,
> though one letter below still refers to them as diner-lounges. Car
> 331 had been retired and scrapped at Lincoln in January 1952,
> leaving only the 330 and 332.
>
> Urbach to Melker, Chicago, 3/27/1953:
> 414.014
> Referring to correspondence enginer with your letter March 20, in
> regard to inspection to be made of parlor-diner cars 330 and 332,
> recently released from company service at Chillicothe [Mo.].
> Mr. Fee now writes as follows concerning these two cars:
> "The 330 has been unloaded at Chicago and shold be moved to Lincoln
> for storage, where the windows should be boarded and car protected
> as necessary against pilferage or damage.
> The 332 is on hand at Hannibal and is being considered for use as a
> building at North St. Louis. If formal authority for that purpose is
> later furnished the car may then be moved to North St. Louis as
> contemplated to serve as eating quarters."
> Please arrange accordingly.
>
> The two cars had apparently been used by the Engineering Department
> during some project in the Chillicothe area, likely connected with
> construction of the new Centennial Cutoff to Kansas City, which had
> opened to freight traffic in October 1952 and to passenger traffic
> in January 1953.
>
> Potarf to Moody, Omaha, 3/30/1953:
> 45-4
> The Vice President has advised that parlor-diner car 330 has been
> unloaded at Chicago and should be moved to Linoln for storage where
> the windows should be boarded and car protected as necessary against
> pilferage and damage.
> Will you please arrange to handle.
>
> Moody to Bloom, Denver, 3/31/1953
> Parlor-Diner Car 330 to Lincoln for Storage
> 412.013 Q
> Note the following from Mr. Potarf, under date of March 30th:
> "The Vice President has advised that parlor-diner car 330 has been
> unloaded at Chicago and should be moved to Linoln for storage where
> the windows should be boarded and car protected as necessary against
> pilferage and damage.
> Will you please arrange to handle."
> For your information and handling.
>
> Melker to H.A. Hollwagen, Chicago, 4/1/1953:
> 414.014
> Referring to correspondence ending with your letter of March 17, in
> regard to inspection made of diner-lounge 330.
> After this car has been unloaded at Chicago, it should be moved to
> Lincoln for storage where windows will be boarded up as protection
> against pilferage or damage. Please arrange to bill this car to
> Lincoln when it is ready, advising.
>
> Potarf to Moody, Omaha, 4/3/1953:
> 45-4
> For your further information in connection with my letter of March
> 30, Mr. Hinshaw has advised under date of April 2, that Dining-
> Parlor car 330 has been unloaded by the Engineering Department at
> Chicago and will be billed to Lincoln for storage and car will be
> moved on first convenient freight train.
> As advised you previously, upon arrival of this car at Lincoln you
> should arrange to have the windows boarded and car protected as
> necessary against pilferage or damage.
>
> Urbach to Moody, Chicago, 4/6/1953:
> 414.014
> Further to my letter March 27 to Mr. Melker, copy to you, about
> parlor-dining car 330 being moved to Lincoln for storage.
> On receipt of this car you should arrange to have windows boarded up
> to protect against pilferage and damage.
> Please advise when this has been handled.
>
> Moody to Bloom, Denver, 4/7/1953:
> Parlor-Diner Car 330 to Lincoln for Storage
> 412.013 Q
> Further to my letter March 31, about parlor-dining car 330 being
> moved to Lincoln for storage.
> On receipt of this car, you should arrange to have windows boarded
> up to protect against pilferage and damage.
> Please advise when this has been handled.
>
> Bloom to Moody, Lincoln, 4/9/1953:
> Parlor-Diner Car 330 to Lincoln for Storage
> 412.013 Q
> Your letter of April 7, file 412.013 Q, on above subject.
> Windows of this car have been boarded up at Lincoln.
>
> Melker to Moody, Chicago, 4/10/1953:
> 414.014
> Referring to Mr. Urbach's letter of March 27, of which you have
> copy, in regard to inspection to be made of parlor-dining cars 330
> and 332, recently released from company service.
> Diner-lounge 330 was unloaded at Chicago and billed to Lincoln,
> April 1.
>
>
> Moody to Urbach, Denver, 4/10/1953:
> Parlor-Diner Car 330 to Lincoln for Storage
> 412.013
> Your letter of April 6, file 414.014, about parlor-dining car 330
> being moved to Lincoln for storage.
> Windows on this car have been boarded up at Lincoln.
>
> That concludes a lengthy exchange (10 letters) over a comparatively
> simple matter -- and all for naught, it would turn out. Neither car
> ever saw service again, the 330 being scrapped at Eola in September
> 1957 and the 332 at Hannibal in December 1955, apparently not having
> been used as a building at North St. Louis. It's interesting to note
> that the proposed use of the 332 in North St. Louis was as "eating
> quarters." Such use would not have necessitated that the car be
> removed from its trucks, and it remains possible that it was used
> for this purpose. Another similar car -- dinette-lounge-solarium
> observation car 221 "Riverview" -- was placed in the yard at Lincoln
> in the mid-1950s, still on its trucks, for use as a lunchroom. First
> painted white with no lettering, it was repainted Pullman green in
> the early 1960s and numbered 250051 in May 1967.
>
> On to another subject: retirement and reuse of the old open platform
> suburban coaches in the 7000 series, made surplus by the arrival of
> new stainless steel gallery cars beginning in 1950. One note: C.E.
> Melker in late 1952 was assistant superintendent of motive power for
> Lines West but was soon to be transferred to LInes East, succeeded
> on Lines West by C.A. Moody:
>
> Urbach to Melker, Chicago, 11/4/1952:
> 412.003
> We have been requested to have the following 14 suburban cars, now
> being held at Lincoln for disposition, inspected to determine
> whether or not any of them would be suitable for conversion to bunk
> cars or for use as buildings.
> 7004, 7007, 7015, 7023, 7024, 7025, 7038, 7041, 7046, 7048, 7053,
> 7055, 7057, 7058
> Please have this inspection made immediately, and let me have your
> recommendations.
> The following 12 Pullman tourist cars on hand at Lincoln should also
> be inspected promptly to determine if any or all of them can be
> converted to company service.
> 1108, 1344, 1462, 1784, 2250, 2299, 2383, 2392, 2416, 2593, 2640, 2652
> Please advise.
>
> Between 1947 and 1954 the Q purchased at total of 69 all-steel
> tourist sleeping cars from Pullman at real bargain basement prices
> for conversion into anything the company might think appropriate.
> Six were converted during 1948 into drovers' cars 5760-5765 (though
> "conversion" is probably to strong a word, as the cars were simply
> painted mineral red with black roofs and had reporting marks and
> numbers applied). The vast majority -- 49 cars -- were painted
> orange and placed in company service, primarily as bunk cars. And
> the remaining 14 were either scrapped at Eola or sold for scrap
> between 1959 and 1963. One of these cars, tourist sleeper 2645,
> became company service car 250275 in January 1949 and today may be
> seen at the Galesburg Railroad Museum, once more sporting its
> original 1921 Pullman name, "Meath." But back to the suburban
> coaches: From Havelock on Nov. 18, 1952, Melker copeid Urbach's
> letter to master mechanic Bloom and, when he had not heard from
> Bloom in what he considered a reasonable time, wrote:
>
> Melker to Bloom, Havelock, 11/26/1952:
> Suburban Cars Suitable for Conversion to Bunk Cars
> 412.003
> Please refer to my letter November 18, above subject and file.
> Please reply promptly.
>
> Bloom to Melker, Lincoln, 12/2/1952:
> Suburban Cars Suitable for Conversion to Bunk Cars
> 412.003
> Your letter of Nov. 18, file 412.003, on above subject.
> All of the cars listed in your letter are practically in the same
> condition and all are OK to be converted to outfit cars.
>
> Melker to Urbach, Havelock, 12/3/1952:
> Suburban and Tourist Cars Suitable for Conversion to Outfit Cars or
> Buildings
> 412.003
> Your letter November 15, file 412.003, regarding above subject:
> All of the suburban cars listed in your letter are suitable for
> conversion to Bunk cars, or for use as buildings, and all of the
> Pullman Tourist cars listed in your letter are suitable to be
> converted to company service cars.
>
> Melker added a P.S. to Bloom:
> I presume the above is what you intended to say in your letter of
> December 2, as your letter does not give desired information.
>
> Urbach to Moody, Chicago, 1/19/1953:
> 412.003
> Referring to correspondence ending with your [actually Melker's]
> letter December 3, file 412.003, in regard to suburban cars on hand
> at Lincoln awaiting disposition.
> Confirming converstation with your office recently, suburban cars
> 7032, 7043, 7040 and 7039, which were leased to the North American
> Steel Company at Camanche, Iowa [on the DRI&NW between Davenport and
> Clinton], were released to us on December 31, and Mr. Fee has
> authorized Mr. Simmons to move them to Lincoln for storage.
> After these four cars have shown up at Lincoln, please make
> necessary inspection, and advise it they are suitable for conversion
> to bunk cars, or for use as buildings.
>
> Moody repeated Urbach's letter in his own message to Bloom on Jan.
> 21, to which Bloom replied:
>
> Bloom to Moody, Lincoln, 1/27/1953:
> Suburban and Tourist Cars Suitable for Conversion to Outfit Cars or
> Buildings
> 412.003
> Your letter of Jan. 21, file 412.003, on above subject.
> The four suburban cars mentioned could be converted to bunk cars or
> can be used as buildings.
>
> Moody relayed the information to Urbach on Jan. 28, and nothing more
> was heard on the subject until June:
>
> Urbach to Melker and Moody, Chicago, June 8:
> 412.011
> We have been requested to furnish a coach for use during the summer
> months by a Careful Handling Committee at small terminals, such as
> Pacific Junction, Bonneville, Seneca, Gillette, etc., for the
> purpose of showing motion pictures in the interest of careful
> handling, claim prevention work, safety first, etc.
> Suburban car 7041 set aside at Lincoln has been selected for this
> purpose, and it is being released for Aurora Shops today. On arrival
> of car at Aurora, it should be thoroughly cleaned, and any items in
> need of attention should be taken care of.
> Mr. Carter will instruct the shop people as to what should be done
> in connection with changes in wiring, lights, etc., and he should be
> contacted promptly on arrival of car at the shops so instructions
> can be given.
> Please arrange accordingly.
>
> Simmons to Moody, Chicago, 2:38 p.m., 6/11/1953:
> SUBURBAN COACH 7041 NOW AT LINCOLN BEING RELEASED BY MECH DEPT TODAY
> FOR DH MOVEMENT TO AURORA SHOP HANDLE ON CONVENIENT FREIGHT TRAIN DH
> TO AURORA ILLS FOR SHOP.
>
> Later that year another of the old suburban cars was put to use:
>
> Urbach to Moody, Chicago, 10/9/1953:
> 412.011
> Mr. G.P. Henson is in need of a second old suburban car for use at
> Morton Park, and wish you would please arrange to select one of
> those now stored at Lincoln, remove the seats, and have it ready so
> it will be able to move on rear end of freight train.
> Please advise number of car selected, and when it is ready to move
> so that I may notify Mr. Simmons to have it moved to Morton Park.
> Prompt handling will be appreciated.
>
> As usual, Moody forwarded the request to Bloom. Before he received a
> reply, Moody heard from Urbach again:
>
> Urbach to Moody, CHicago, 10/26/1953:
> 412.011
> Referring to my letter October 9, in regard to removing seats from
> one of the old suburban cars set aside at Lincoln, and have car
> ready so it can move on rear end of freight train to Morton Park.
> Please advise present status promptly.
>
> When Moody contacted Bloom again he at last received a reply:
>
> Bloom to Moody, Lincoln, 10/29/1953:
> Old Suburban Car for Use at Morton Park
> 412.011 Q
> Your letter of October 12, file 412.011 Q, on above subject.
> Old suburban car 7038 was ready last Friday [10/27] and moved out
> Lincoln on rear end of freight train. Understand from Mr. Henson
> that he has received car.
>
> The next day, Moody passed the news on to Urbach, and that was that.
> Anyone know what the cars were being used for at Morton Park?
>
> All for now.
>
> Hol
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
>
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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