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To all interested in CTC operation on CB&Q. Although I did not start as a Dispatcher until Valentine Day 1974 I was trained by all CB& Dispatchers. The first job I worked in the Cicero Office was 2nd trick C&I (Aurora to Savanna CTC and then the double track La Crosse Div. Savanna to St. Croix DS operated CTC at Galena Jct((Op Operated CTC at Crawford to PDC(((At PDC))) ((((CX North Lacrosse op handled CTC Harrington-Grand Crossing(Milw)Then into La Crosse Yd and north to Sullivan and East Winona and Miner to Mears(Single track after Floods in '65) and OP Prescott to Hastings Consolidated Code 1967 was the Rule Book used. Rule 275(P137-138) covers DUAL CONTROL SWITCHES Rule 275A Tells how to take off and operated. One nite working 3rd Trick C&I off the extra board(Time book lost in move to Galesburg) ICE brought down the Code Line at Eola. SO NO CTC Eola West to Aurora. C&I CTC machine and Main Line CTC out of service. I ran Three trains both East and West over C&I by a crystal clear Radio. When the first train got to Sugar Grove I had to talk him by the signal and he would 275A the switch at the East and again at the West End of the CTC Siding. Taking the west switch off power would throw the current of traffic westbound so after he cleared the switch and put it back on power he proceeded to the next signal and that would be lined for him automaticly to Big Rock where he would do it again. I kept track of the progress on the train sheet and the delays. To make a meet I would tell the train to enter the siding to meet Extra 1234 East at the West End of Big Rock And after 1234 East 275A the west switch at Big Rock he could 275A out to the main and head west. With the clear radio and although COLD and blowing we made running meets account we had Way Cars with someone to line the switch and put it back on power which would then reline the current of traffic. So it worked slick. Course back then the crews only worked Aurora(Cicero)-Savanna, Savanna(JO) to No. Lacrosse(CX) and CX to St. Croix the last two crew districts all ABS(Rule 251) And often we knew the crews as we rode the dinkeys with them so we were often on first name basis. Things worked easier in the Dark Ages of Railroading. Retired now 17 years wonder if my PTSD will act up to nite. Good Nite Steve in SC
On Tuesday, February 10, 2026 at 12:54:18 PM EST, Richard Gortowski via groups.io <rgortowski=aol.com@groups.io> wrote:
Thanks for all of the great responses and links to the articles on the switch machines. A few years ago, Brandon had provided me these articles as well as a straight line signaling diagram from Aurora to Savanna - a real treasure. I should have checked in there first, but didn't think to do so. In re-reading them, the CTC between Aurora and Savanna was added in three phases. The first phase - Steward Junction to Flag Center was installed in 1929, the article states that they used 5-B dual control GRS switch motors. The second phase was installed between Aurora and Steward Junction in 1942 and the article states that they used 5-D dual control GRS switch motors. The finale phase between Flag Center and Savanna was installed in 1946, and they also used the 5-D dual control GRS switch motors. I'm sure these were upgraded in later years, but for my 1950 layout it appears the earlier versions were likely in use. Looking at what's available, Showcase Miniatures has what looks like an earlier version, but without dual control. Adding a handle mechanism isn't very difficult.  Northwestern Scale Models has a 5-A, again without dual control:  They also have the 5-H with dual control:  I've ordered test models of these and will determine which will I like best. I need nine of these for the "controlled" switches on the layout, which we are wiring to a pseudo CTC board. Glen, I'm modeling from Steward, IL to the National Silica plant just west of Oregon, IL, plus the branch up to Mt Morris, IL, which in 1950 was switched by an R-5a Prairie. We also model the Milwaukee Road trackage rights between Steward Junction and Flagg Center. I just finished up building the last of the Milwaukee switches and my friend wired everything so we can run the two Milwaukee trains out of storage and across the Q mainline. In 1950, the Milwaukee was using L-2a Mikados for this branch. We're working on scenery on the Mt Morris/Oregon side of the layout. Rich
On Monday, February 9, 2026 at 08:09:48 AM CST, Leo Phillipp via groups.io <qutlx1=aol.com@groups.io> wrote:
Steve, My memory is you are correct. Otherwise when the machine was in “hand throw” mode the brakeman would be standing between the main and the siding where footing was tough and there probably also wasn’t clearance for hand throw mechanism. Now speaking of those occasions where you and other DS’,s would state”take the switch off power and operate per ruleXXX” (i know that’s not it exactly but close). It seemed that most of those events were in the dead of winter with temps well below zero and the wind howling. It was tough enough to wrestle those massive mainline switches over on a warm summer day but in winter it was poor hell. Usually these failures were when one was trying to enter or leave a siding on the head end but one night we played with the west switch at Mored two or three times from the rear end after we were in the clear and the switch wouldn’t return to normal. And yes indeed it was minus 15 or 20 degrees with a wind chill of minus 40 or 50 and lots of snow blowing. Switch machine never responded to the DS so the next few guys westbound had to be talked by the west signal at Mored until the maintainer got there. We sat in the siding there at Mored for awhile. Leo Phillipp On Feb 9, 2026, at 7:04 AM, Steve Moerke via groups.io <smurky=gmail.com@groups.io> wrote:
Just to clarify, in addition to the motor end toward the frog aren’t the dual control levers always on the field side? Steve On Feb 8, 2026, at 17:07, zephyr98072 via groups.io <glenehaug=msn.com@groups.io> wrote:
Rich:
There was an article written in "Railway Signaling" in April 1930 describing the CTC installation between Steward Junction and Flag Center, and the article along with a photo of a typical switch machine installation confirms everything that Brandon indicated,
including the orientation of the machine with respect to the turnout. I think there is a copy of this article on the BRHS website.
I can't remember if your layout extends east of Steward or West of Flag Center, but if so, there are also articles describing the 1942 installation of CTC between Aurora and Steward Junction, and the 1947 installation between Flag Center and Savanna Tower.
Both of these articles also include photos, and reference to GRS Model 5 dual control machines. From these photos, it appears that CB&Q used the above machine orientation universally.
Glen Haug
From: CBQ@groups.io <CBQ@groups.io> on behalf of Brandon Otterstrom via groups.io <brandono13=yahoo.com@groups.io>
Sent: Sunday, February 8, 2026 8:30 AM To: CBQ@groups.io <CBQ@groups.io> Subject: Re: [CBQ] GRS Switch Machines Rich,
The GRS 5H (Dual-control)would be the machine you want to use for your layout. The "Q" typical placed machines on the side of the normally-closed point. The motor end of the machine is toward the frog.
Brandon Otterstrom
BNSF Rochelle, IL Signal Maintainer
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