Re: [CBQ] CB&Q-NYC Pooled Trains

["William Hirt via groups.io" <whirt=fastmail.com@groups.io>]

Pooled trains always received whatever the top end power on the system at the time. Earl Currie did a presentation at a Spring meet several years ago and made the point that in the 1960s, all railroads had to sell was service. The ICC set freight rates and everybody had charge what rates the ICC had set. So these run through trains were established to try to get or maintain business.

One of the earliest Q pooled trains were CGI and GI68 which were joint with the UP. It started when GP9s were top end power on the system.

The 1969 operating sheets which has been published a couple of times by the BRHS shows these run through trains:

NYQ - Westbound

NYC Elkhart Yard - CB&Q Cicero Yard. Trains bypassed NYC Englewood Yard, Cars were switched at Cicero for forwarding to UP Grand Island, Denver, Twin Cities and Kansas City.

QNY - Eastbound

Galesburg - Cicero Yard (adds forwarder merchandise, dead freight and billed empties) - bypasses NYC Englewood Yard - NYC Elkhart

PQU - Westbound

Pittsburgh (Conway Yard) (PR-3 train) - Cicero Yard (cars pulled for Denver, Twin Cities and Kansas City - UP Green River WY (via Grand Island).

UQP - Eastbound

UP Green River - Galesburg (pulls any Q proper traffic) - Cicero Yard ( Adds PRR traffic) Chicago PRR 59th St Yard - Train PR-4 to Pittsburgh Conway Yard

It should be noted these trains did not last very long after the PC merger as the PC in an effort to save money would not fill locomotive fuel tanks. Also the Q found one of their U25Bs was being used to pull PC MOW trains in Indiana.

EL-CB&Q Westbound

Marion OH - Cicero Yard.

Train switched at Cicero to set up cars for Q trains to Grand Island, Denver, Kansas City and Twin Cities.

CB&Q - EL Eastbound

Cicero Yard - EL Hammond IN- Marion OH

Bill Hirt

On 2/6/2025 2:52 PM, Rob Bennett via groups.io wrote:

I would like to model the CB&Q-NYC joint freights on my layout. I am on the "NYC" end, so the CB&Q units "should" be in the consist, but not leading due to the NYC ATS system.

 

Some questions:

 

1. Where did these trains run to/from? I think St Paul - Selkirk. Any others? (Denver?)

2. What were the symbols on the Q and NYC?

3. Did the Q power run all the way to Selkirk (or whatever the NYC destination was). I have seen pictures of Q power on the NYC in Elkhart, IN and NYC power on the Q in Denver, CO.

4. Timeframe these runs started?

5. What was predominate traffic? (this is so I know to run Boxcars, Auto Parts Boxcars, Auto racks, Reefers...any Covered Hoppers, coal hoppers, tank cars, gondolas?)

6. What Q power was (mostly) used? I have seen an SD24 in the Chinese Red scheme. I assume that GP30s, GP35s, U25B would be used- did any of the Blackbird scheme Geeps or SD7/9's make it onto the NYC. How about some F3s or F7s! (I may have to do that anyway- it is my layout!)

 

I really like the CB&Q schemes- both the Chinese Red and the Blackbird. Dang nice! And I think the F units look cool as well.

 

Many thanks!

 

Rob Bennett

Fairview, PA

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