Ken, Perry:
My repair guy, Jan Willard, has finished with the S-2a mods. This turned into a very expensive project, for a couple of reasons. The worst of the problems was that apparently the rods are tied to the drivers with rivets that were soldered
to the rods after the heads were pressed over. He also had to rebuild the front truck to get the model to track well. If your models don’t have those issues, life gets better.
The backhead is something I just will not do without, but it’s sometimes an expensive proposition, because in models like this one, the boiler must be extended back into the cab to locate the backhead in the correct position. Note that
trying to solder a boiler extension inside the cab is a hopeless task, so Jan uses JB -Weld for that and for mounting the motor. JB Weld will withstand any baking process for Scalecoat (400F “glassification” temperature), but can be lifted by some really
aggressive cleaning regimens, so you MUST discuss such mods with your painter!
Jan also said that the S-2a model has very narrow space for motor and gearbox location, though the PSC gearbox fit without mod. Of course, installing a gearbox requires re-quartering the drivers afterward.
Note that I won’t have the model in hand for several weeks yet (Jan has to work off enough models to fill a shipping box for me), so I’m going off Jan’s photos (attached) and email description. OK, here’s the damage:
Parts: FAULHABER 1524T0112SR. 65.00 2) PSC. 4018 33:1 gearbox 55.00 3) MISC BRASS MTL 1.00 4) CUSTOM BACKHEAD 22.00. I also provided Jan about $20 in other PSC parts. The Faulhaber part number indicates it’s a 15mm dia x 24mm long motor.
Note that the Faulhaber is an expensive motor, but I’ve found them to be silky smooth, and very powerful for their size. (I doubt that a 15mm dia normal can motor would provide satisfactory power for this model.) We considered one of the very inexpensive
(but powerful) 15mm square motors, but those have very low RPM, typically not suited to a passenger loco, even with a 27:1 gearbox. Normally Jan uses 27:1 PSC gearboxes; I’m not sure why he went with the 33:1 (might have been availability issues.) Jan refuses
to use the cheaper NWSL gearboxes because of recurring issues with them. The PSC gearboxes are bullet-proof and very smooth.
The labor for everything, including the “pump and a half” and extra air piping mods, driveline remediation (with fabricated torque arm and rivet fix), boiler extension, backhead, etc. was $500. Without the rivet problem, he thinks it would
have been $400—but if all LMB S-2a’s were riveted like this, you are going to incur this extra charge, as there is no way to replace the gearbox without breaking these rod rivets. Without the “pump and a half”, air piping, and backhead, I’d guess (and that’s
ALL it is) would be ~$100 - $150 less.
At the bottom line, if all you really want out of this is a low current motor compatible with DCC, and can live with your original gearbox, do so! Alternatively, you could even leave in your original open frame motor, and use an O-scale
DCC decoder, which typically deliver 4 amps continuously. Only if you need to replace the gearbox should you. Only if you can’t stand a big honking magnet visible in the cab should you go to a shorter motor, boiler extension, and backhead. Only if
you want a truly unique model should you go for the air pump and piping mod.
The above notwithstanding, this is likely to be the very last (and only) LMB model I will ever own. They seem to take a LOT of work to make a competent model out of.
I you’re still interested, I can send you Jan’s contact info privately.
Best,
-Eric
Sent from
Mail for Windows
Eric:
Thanks for your informative response and looking forward to updates. I/we have not done a project like this before and appreciate your input.
No worries about the name thing.
Perry Bilotta
On Sep 10, 2022, at 10:15 AM, Bott, Eric H. <eric.h.bott@outlook.com> wrote:
Perry:
Apologies for my incorrect citation of your name! My bad.
I think our models are LMB rather than Lambert. LMB is even more old-school, with less detail and crankier drivetrains, but thicker brass for the superstructures. In addition to a modern motor, I’m expecting my mod guy (Jan) to tell me
that the gearbox needs replacing. When that’s his opinion, we always go with a PSC gearbox, as NWSL has been disappointing for several years now. Of course, a gearbox swap also involves checking and blueprinting the quartering
all of the drivers.
Depending on which driver axle has the gearbox, and the dimensions of the model, even a coreless motor of the biggest diameter that will fit into the boiler may still be too long to allow correct location of a backhead. We’ve gone one
or both of two ways to fix this. The expensive way is to move the gearbox forward a driver axle, though this usually entails altering the frame cross-members, and in some cases the valve gear hanger. (We did all of that on a Westside PRR G-5 4-6-0, and a
Westside UP A-2 4-4-2 that we also modded into a C&A configuration) and they came out superbly, but took a LOT of time and effort.) Moving the gearbox forward typically allows a motor to be moved ~3/4” forward in a model, but sometimes requires the bottom
opening of the boiler to be widened to allow assembly/disassembly of the model. The cheaper and less invasive (but sometimes still insufficient) way is to get one of those square motors that the Repower and Regear groups.io folks are raving about. They are
extremely strong for their size, and typically even shorter than a coreless motor of equal power. But they typically run at lower RPM than other motors, and even with a 27:1 gearbox (vs a 37:1) are slower than one would like in a passenger loco model. On
the plus side, they seem to be fully compatible with DCC, and run very smoothly.
Another consideration is that many older models don’t extend the boiler shell back into the cab at all, or far enough. In these cases, a boiler extension must be fabricated and installed to put the backhead in the correct place. What’s
the correct place? Well, it should align vertically with the back end of the firebox, whose aft lower corners are usually visible below the cab.
Additionally, many of the older models lack cab floors, or have only partially complete cab floors. That doesn’t work for me, so Jan also takes care of that.
I’ll ask Jan to take photos through the process, and email you with the results. I’m often the first guy to pose him with a particular model for this work, so I get to pay him for his learning curve. Typically a first effort like this
runs $250, if I supply the motor. Paint and finishing to my (very exacting) standards for a model like the S-2 would typically run me $375 (including separate cab interior color and graphited smokebox and firebox.) And I want some detail mods done to the
S-2, which will raise the cost a bit further. To many, it will sound utterly crazy to spend this kind of money (even before DCC and lights) on a $150 model. I just don’t like to have to apologize for any aspect of any of my models, and I very much like the
whole “one of one” thing. (There are plenty of photos of most steam loco classes out there, so why should any of our loco models look the same? I particularly like modeling Missouri Pacific steam, as after a few years of service, no two locos of any class
looked the same on that road.)
YMMV. We’re all crazy in some way, viewed through other’s lenses.
Best,
-Eric
Sent from
Mail for Windows
Eric:
How is this project coming along? I have a Lambert S-2 and would like to remoter and convert to DCC. Do you have a recommendation on a motor? How it is mounted? And which backhead to use? I went to American Scale Models and they have 4 backheads listed. Can
you post a photo motor installation? Any information would be helpful. Thanks.
Perry Bilotta
_._,_._,_
Groups.io Links: You receive all messages sent to this group. View/Reply Online (#64518) | Reply To Group | Reply To Sender | Mute This Topic | New Topic
Your Subscription | Contact Group Owner | Unsubscribe [archives@nauer.org]
_._,_._,_
|
MOTOR_MOUNT_TORQUE_ARM.jpg
Description: MOTOR_MOUNT_TORQUE_ARM.jpg
LH_SIDE_VIEW.jpg
Description: LH_SIDE_VIEW.jpg
LMB_BACKHEAD_BRSS.jpg
Description: LMB_BACKHEAD_BRSS.jpg
LMB_NEWCOMPRESSORS.jpg
Description: LMB_NEWCOMPRESSORS.jpg
cbq2914-1.jpg
Description: cbq2914-1.jpg
|
