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Here on the Beardstown Division, train 11 & 12's baggagemen wore clean bibs, work shirts and Cromer caps. That was a PMC run. From: "Jpslhedgpeth@aol.com" <Jpslhedgpeth@aol.com> To: CBQ@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, March 6, 2012 1:01 PM Subject: Re: [CBQ] Gas Electric in Rochelle, IL-Motor Car Manning Leo et al
Just a little "memory flashback before I forget it"....Jim Christen and I rode Train No. 15 from Wymore to Oxford in Mid August 1954. The train consisted of a full baggage-mail motorcar ( I have the number, but am not "disposed" to get out of my chair and look it up) and a steel coach as trailer.
Out of Wymore there was a Conductor and Brakeman...both in full passenger uniform....At Red Cloud, where the crew changed the conductor wore a full passenger uniform, but the brakeman-baggageman wore "bibs" with passenger uniform cap.
I'll be very much interested in seeing whether the uniform on these trains was "optional and up to the individual or was required by company rule.
I just thought of my own personal experience as a trainman on the Wymore Division summer 1958....On a hot June night I was the brakeman on the Pioneer Zephyr running as Train 44 from Lincoln to St. Joseph, MO. I wore a regulation passenger uniform (blue serge...no lighweight fabric then) and performed mail messenger service at every stattion, including those unmanned...Dragging mail sacks from the mail compartment to the depot or "shed" and outgoing mail from said shed or depot back to the train.
'
Talk about hot and sweaty....Sure felt good to get into air conditioned comfort on a plush Mohair seat in the PZ's passenger compartment...I consider that night one of the highlights of my railroad career...Servicing as a paid company servant on the most historic train in CB&Q history. Can't take that away from me.....and can't be repeated...I'm most grateful. Pete
-----Original Message-----
Pete et al,
Here directly from a future Zephyr article that looks into the day to day operation and manning of motor cars 39,40,41 and 42 between Sterling-PawPaw-Shabbona-Paw Paw-Earlville-Serena,IL and reverse return trip on the Aurora Division in the lates 20s is the manning agreement quote for motor cars. (Get out your maps and follow this job over many miles of Q track that is now all long gone.)
This clause in the Brotherhood of Railroad Trainman’s (BRT) schedule was Rule 15, A. It stated “that the number of men operating gasoline motor cars over branch lines will be agreed to by negotiation, considering service requirements”.
Unless other wise negotiated a motor car crew was a engineer,Condr,a brknm and if work level required a baggageman/expressman. As this was the crew from the corresponding steam train that was replaced,less the fireman. Of course these runs all varied and that is why Rule 15A was negotiated when motor cars started being placed in service in the mid 20s. It was because this agreement rule was not adhered to in 1926 that I stumbled on a wealth of documents describing this job in great detail in the BRT/UTU files.
I think the article and many of the visuals will provide a full level of understanding of what working a motor car was like back in the day when they were the maids of all chores carrying passengers,express,baggage,milk,newspapers,etc,etc,etc. There is even a "joint check of service" report showing passenger counts on/off and parcels,items handled at each and every station. At one point in the article I ask if the Condr wore a uniform or bibs given the chores assigned !
Leo Phillipp
Attached Message
And gas electrics in passenger service only required a motorman (engineer) and conductor plus a baggageman if baggage was handled or if he was acting as an express messenger.
From: "Jpslhedgpeth@aol.com" <Jpslhedgpeth@aol.com>
To: CBQ@yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, March 5, 2012 11:17 PM Subject: Re: [CBQ] Gas Electric in Rochelle, IL Steve et al
I don't think that the use of a motorcar (gas electric) ITSELF was the deciding factor on the number of brakemen required...This could, of course, vary from district to district.
In 1956 I worked the Hastings-Huntley local which used the 9769 for power. We had two brakemen. The local operated Monday Wednesday Friday Hastings- Huntley (all branch lines). Tue and Thursday it operated Hastings-Sutton thence north to Lushton back to Sutton and then south to Clay Center. (Hastings-Sutton main line). I recall someone saying that a local operating exclusively in all branch line territory only one brakeman was required.
But I never saw anything official or in writing about this.
In another case the Tarkio Valley branch local (Villisca Ia-Corning MO) always had two brakeman and that was all branch line territory.
IIRC in passenger service only one brakeman was required if the consist was 5 cars or less.
Leo can you give us definitive info on this...I've often wondered about it.
Pete
-----Original Message----- From: STEVEN HOLDING <sholding@sbcglobal.net> To: CBQ <CBQ@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Mon, Mar 5, 2012 9:30 pm Subject: Re: [CBQ] Gas Electric in Rochelle, IL
Leo and Rich Being on the Rockford Wayfreight makes sense as I was told the job only had one brakeman by agreement due to the use of the Gas Electric and not needing the extra man. The gas electrics were used until they crapped out and then some rebuilt into coaches while others just replaced by diesels. We use to have to put the number of brakemen on the train sheet as some crews only had one Steve in SC
From: "rgortowski@aol.com" <rgortowski@aol.com>
To: CBQ@yahoogroups.com Sent: Mon, March 5, 2012 9:11:38 AM Subject: Re: [CBQ] Gas Electric in Rochelle, IL Leo,
Is the gas electric in the photo on a culvert? Is there a creek right by the station?
Rich
-----Original Message----- From: qutlx1 <qutlx1@aol.com> To: cbq <cbq@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Mon, Mar 5, 2012 7:48 am Subject: Fwd: [CBQ] Gas Electric in Rochelle, IL
This second photo sure looks like #42 going east at the Rochelle depot. What is viewable of the depot would be correct for Rochelle and the elevator would be in the right position.
As we've discussed the job didnt exist by 1951. Without going into the BRT/UTU files and searching my memory says the motor car came off in 1948.
Just wondering out loud if after the motor car came off it was used on the Rockford wayfreight for awhile ? But that job hauled a fairly good train down to Flag Center and back to Rockford each night each night.
??????????????
Leo Phillipp
Attached Message
Here is another of his photos of a gas-electric in what appears to be Rochelle to me:
Maybe the dates are wrong? I wouldn't expect a gas-electric, especially with a trailing unit to be in Rochelle in 1951.
Rich G.
-----Original Message----- From: qutlx1 <qutlx1@aol.com> To: cbq <cbq@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Mon, Mar 5, 2012 7:26 am Subject: Fwd: [CBQ] Gas Electric in Rochelle, IL
Good question Rich,
If the location is identified correctly. From the photo the site appears to be looking west and the car is on the west end of the Kennedy track.
#41/42 was the daily motor car between Rockford and Aurora but by 1950 it is not in the C&I ETT. It is in the 1947.
The Rockford wayfreight ran from Rockford to Rochelle each night and return. Could this be the Rockford wayfreight powerrunning late and tied up for beans before going back to Rockford ?
Leo
Attached Message
If this dealer has the location correct, there was a Gas-Electric in Rochelle, IL. in January 1951. Why would that be?
Rich G.
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